119 | Steph Abegg: The Beta Queen - Passions, Partnerships, & Publications

If you don't already know who Steph Abegg is, I can almost certainly say that you've used her work. Her detailed route topos, trip reports, and beta overlays appear all over the internet covering climbs from the North Cascades to Red Rocks. For nearly 20 years, she's been quietly building one of the most comprehensive free climbing resources on the internet—not for profit, not for sponsorship, but because she genuinely loves documenting routes and helping people have better days in the mountains. She's what the climbing community needs more of: someone creating value without asking for anything in return.

This is Steph's second time on the show. Three years ago, she had just landed a data science job and bought a house in Estes Park. Now she's unemployed, living in a Transit van, and writing a book of her favorite climbs across North America. What happened in between is a story about rejection, redirection, and choosing passion over security—even when it doesn't make financial sense.

#femaleclimber #rockclimbing

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Transcript

00:00:00:13 - 00:00:05:12
Kyle
You know, I was listening to a little bit of the episode we did. It's been three years.

00:00:05:14 - 00:00:08:03
Kyle
It's been a long time. I know it's crazy.

00:00:08:10 - 00:00:09:02
Steph
in those three years.

00:00:09:09 - 00:00:20:23
Kyle
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I was literally just going to say, like, it's wild how much time flies. And it's like, how much time flies. But at the same time you look, look back at it and there's like so much change and so many things that have happened.

00:00:20:25 - 00:00:40:08
Kyle
Like, I was still living in Reno. Max was still a part of the show. You know, we haven't been doing any in-person podcasts, like, you know, you like, at least from the last time we spoke, like you had just landed a big job. You know, you were moving outside of the academic world and had recently moved into your new house in Estes Park.

00:00:40:10 - 00:00:42:21
Kyle
Catch us up on on your life since then?

00:00:42:23 - 00:00:47:15
Steph
So I at the time, I thought that was my forever home. I had a cat. I had a job at a house.

00:00:47:15 - 00:00:50:15
Steph
It was great mountain home. And then,

00:00:50:17 - 00:00:53:22
Steph
A lot of things changed, but I would have never predicted.

00:00:53:22 - 00:00:54:16
Steph
Where I am now.

00:00:54:16 - 00:00:56:06
Steph
And I would have dreamed to be where I am.

00:00:56:06 - 00:01:05:07
Steph
Now and just, just wouldn't have, like, put myself there. But right now, I'm living on the road, jobless, and living in a van and.

00:01:05:07 - 00:01:06:20
Steph
Kind of doing what I love, which is building.

00:01:06:20 - 00:01:14:14
Steph
Content for my website and writing a book on my favorite climbs and going around the country having adventures. And

00:01:14:17 - 00:01:21:23
Kyle
yeah, was the was the, is the joblessness by choice or is it kind of a situation that was forced upon you?

00:01:21:26 - 00:01:25:15
Steph
yes and no. So I, I quit the job.

00:01:25:17 - 00:01:31:03
Steph
Intending to go back with the company within, about six months, and I took a coding bootcamp, a pretty.

00:01:31:03 - 00:01:38:03
Steph
Rigorous coding bootcamp at the University of Denver. And I thought for sure that would get me, you know, just a better position with the company.

00:01:38:04 - 00:01:43:11
Steph
Something that I enjoyed more than what I was doing. And, you know, the.

00:01:43:14 - 00:01:45:11
Steph
Six months came and went and.

00:01:45:11 - 00:01:46:03
Steph
They didn't have.

00:01:46:03 - 00:01:46:16
Steph
The job.

00:01:46:16 - 00:01:48:25
Steph
For me anymore. The economy had changed.

00:01:48:25 - 00:01:50:08
Steph
The election had happened.

00:01:50:11 - 00:01:55:20
Steph
And, yeah, the job just didn't exist anymore for me. And so.

00:01:55:23 - 00:01:59:10
Steph
I tried to get a job for a while, I think for about a year. I applied.

00:01:59:10 - 00:02:03:08
Steph
To, a couple hundred, maybe 300 jobs.

00:02:03:11 - 00:02:04:08
Steph
So many jobs.

00:02:04:08 - 00:02:11:08
Steph
Got to the final interview round on, you know, it's dozen of them. And, you know, I thought for sure I was going to get a couple and then never did.

00:02:11:10 - 00:02:15:24
Steph
And, you know, came to a conclusion that I kind of had a lack of experience.

00:02:15:24 - 00:02:22:00
Steph
For my years, you know, despite the fact I had three master's degrees and, and the coding boot camp, I.

00:02:22:00 - 00:02:22:29
Steph
Just had so little.

00:02:22:29 - 00:02:23:27
Steph
Experience in the data

00:02:24:02 - 00:02:25:03
Kyle
science world.

00:02:25:06 - 00:02:28:21
Kyle
Like actual, like onsite job experience.

00:02:28:21 - 00:02:31:17
Steph
experience. I had two years and I was getting booted out.

00:02:31:17 - 00:02:31:26
Steph
By.

00:02:31:26 - 00:02:35:24
Steph
Younger people who are just, you know, fresh faces or people.

00:02:35:24 - 00:02:39:09
Steph
Who had much more experience. And,

00:02:39:11 - 00:02:40:17
Steph
Yeah, I was living in Estes Park.

00:02:40:17 - 00:02:44:21
Steph
And and paying a mortgage on the house during this time and also on the road a.

00:02:44:21 - 00:02:45:06
Steph
Lot, because.

00:02:45:06 - 00:02:46:15
Steph
I wasn't just going to sit there with that.

00:02:46:15 - 00:02:48:16
Steph
Job. So my house was sitting empty.

00:02:48:17 - 00:03:00:24
Steph
My cat had been living at a friend's house. The climbing partner's wife had taken him in, and it was just like, wow. Well, I'm I've got to think about this. I love what I'm doing on the road.

00:03:00:26 - 00:03:02:05
Steph
You know, this this life.

00:03:02:05 - 00:03:03:24
Steph
On the road and developing content.

00:03:03:24 - 00:03:05:09
Steph
Was. It was really what I loved doing.

00:03:05:09 - 00:03:10:16
Steph
And I thought, well, I'll rent out my house in Estes Park, I'll move out moving in my Rav four.

00:03:10:16 - 00:03:13:13
Steph
And so that's what I did. The whole last year was spent.

00:03:13:13 - 00:03:16:20
Steph
Living in my Rav4. And, at some.

00:03:16:20 - 00:03:19:16
Steph
Point I stopped applying for jobs and just kind of went for the.

00:03:19:16 - 00:03:27:09
Steph
The writing of my book. Of my favorite climbs. And that's been a full time thing. You know, I've spent a.

00:03:27:09 - 00:03:29:28
Steph
Lot of hours on that book. It's pretty well built out, except.

00:03:29:28 - 00:03:34:04
Steph
For, you know, the last climbs I might want to add to it. And paring it down

00:03:34:07 - 00:04:02:02
Kyle
That's cool. It's interesting how, I don't know, sometimes the world like, pushes us in certain directions, no matter how much we. We fight it. How how has that kind of realization process been? Because, I mean, like applying for jobs, 200 jobs, like, I mean, it's devastating work. So much rejection, so much like. Yeah. How how do you how do you maintain, like, a positive attitude and like, how do you get through something like that?

00:04:02:02 - 00:04:04:03
Kyle
Because that's it's hard.

00:04:04:06 - 00:04:05:05
Steph
It's hard. It's who I.

00:04:05:05 - 00:04:08:24
Steph
Trained for my whole life of three master's degrees and, you know, went for.

00:04:08:26 - 00:04:09:04
Steph
A high.

00:04:09:04 - 00:04:12:24
Steph
Level job and wasn't getting it. But all along, in the last.

00:04:13:00 - 00:04:15:20
Steph
Since 2006, my true.

00:04:15:22 - 00:04:24:17
Steph
You know, true passion in life has been documenting, climbing and presenting that beta for, for, you know, for everyone to use. And I.

00:04:24:17 - 00:04:26:06
Steph
Realized that that's exactly what I was.

00:04:26:06 - 00:04:27:01
Steph
Doing, you know, in the.

00:04:27:03 - 00:04:29:08
Steph
Last couple of years without a job, I was just having.

00:04:29:08 - 00:04:34:11
Steph
More time to do that, and I was loving it. And I was getting more and more,

00:04:34:14 - 00:04:35:29
Steph
Receptive responses through.

00:04:35:29 - 00:04:43:25
Steph
Instagram, through, you know, I rebuilt my website during the time, too, and just getting more and more,

00:04:43:27 - 00:04:45:20
Steph
Responses towards it that were.

00:04:45:27 - 00:04:47:20
Steph
You know, really encouraging.

00:04:47:20 - 00:04:55:08
Steph
And I was like, you know, I should I should just go for this because I really, truly love it. That's what I'm doing anyway. Stop stressing about the whole job thing.

00:04:55:08 - 00:05:00:11
Steph
You'll either come or it won't, and maybe I'll try to make my own way. So right now I'm renting out my place.

00:05:00:11 - 00:05:01:13
Steph
Nest is I still do.

00:05:01:13 - 00:05:07:12
Steph
Own it, but, it's nice to have someone covering the mortgage for me. I moved out of.

00:05:07:12 - 00:05:09:24
Steph
My Rav four into a transit this year because.

00:05:09:24 - 00:05:11:08
Steph
Full time life on the road.

00:05:11:08 - 00:05:12:24
Steph
Requires a bit bigger vehicle.

00:05:12:29 - 00:05:14:13
Kyle
I'm surprised you lasted a year.

00:05:14:16 - 00:05:15:06
Steph
I surprised as.

00:05:15:06 - 00:05:15:13
Steph
20.

00:05:15:13 - 00:05:18:13
Steph
Years I pretty much for 20 years I was.

00:05:18:13 - 00:05:22:07
Steph
Living a lot in my Rav4 around the edges. You know.

00:05:22:07 - 00:05:27:20
Steph
I was working remote so and then as a student and as a teacher, I'd have summers off.

00:05:27:20 - 00:05:33:23
Steph
And just move into my Subaru or Rav4 and van. Life is great. I'm really loving it.

00:05:33:27 - 00:05:35:22
Steph
It's only been a couple of weeks, but

00:05:35:23 - 00:05:36:18
Kyle
Wow. It's fresh.

00:05:36:20 - 00:05:37:09
Steph
Yeah. Oh, yeah.

00:05:37:09 - 00:05:39:02
Steph
I just got it. This is the first trip

00:05:39:07 - 00:05:43:20
Kyle
Okay. Congratulations. That's awesome. You have a name for you?

00:05:43:23 - 00:05:44:20
Steph
Know, it's.

00:05:44:23 - 00:05:45:15
Steph
It's got a developer.

00:05:45:15 - 00:05:46:29
Steph
Name, but yeah, it's.

00:05:46:29 - 00:05:49:12
Steph
Transit 2015 transit.

00:05:49:15 - 00:05:49:21
Steph
Yeah.

00:05:49:26 - 00:05:51:22
Kyle
Where do you. Where'd you find it?

00:05:51:24 - 00:05:53:00
Steph
I found it on Facebook.

00:05:53:00 - 00:05:54:12
Steph
Martin marketplace.

00:05:54:14 - 00:05:55:16
Steph
Guy in Portland.

00:05:55:18 - 00:06:01:02
Steph
Biker from Portland had it. And he and his wife had, you know, kind of stopped using it for the last couple of years.

00:06:01:02 - 00:06:09:00
Steph
And so he put it on the market and he was looking for a good buyer rather than, having it at a very high price and says, I got that. That one looks like.

00:06:09:00 - 00:06:12:27
Steph
A good deal. It's got 65,000 miles, which is quite low.

00:06:12:29 - 00:06:21:02
Steph
Well-maintained single owner. And it was built out already and solar and everything. And I was like, that's it. So I drove all the way into Portland and a rental.

00:06:21:02 - 00:06:23:16
Steph
Car looked at it was like, yep, this is it.

00:06:23:16 - 00:06:24:24
Steph
And drove it home.

00:06:24:27 - 00:06:26:07
Kyle
Do you still have the Rav4?

00:06:26:10 - 00:06:27:14
Steph
yes, I do.

00:06:27:17 - 00:06:29:05
Steph
The Rav4 only has 110,000.

00:06:29:05 - 00:06:34:08
Steph
Miles on it. So, it's, it's got some life, and I, I figure.

00:06:34:08 - 00:06:36:18
Steph
It's it's probably better to keep it. So right.

00:06:36:18 - 00:06:40:01
Steph
Now, it's parked in my parent's driveway, and, I'm not paying insurance.

00:06:40:01 - 00:06:42:05
Steph
It's just covered with a tarp, so.

00:06:42:08 - 00:06:46:08
Steph
Yeah. Yeah, life might change again. So I don't want to have to, you know, throw money into a.

00:06:46:08 - 00:06:47:08
Steph
Car that's.

00:06:47:10 - 00:06:50:06
Steph
Unreliable. My Rav4 is very reliable.

00:06:50:08 - 00:07:07:19
Kyle
I know a couple of people who are like, just van and then like that they live that lifestyle for a while, but then circumstances change and then they live here in the city and all they have is a van and it's like, that's tough. Like urban living in a van, having to commute with it or park it or go shopping with it.

00:07:07:22 - 00:07:08:06
Steph
the blind.

00:07:08:06 - 00:07:09:17
Steph
Spots are there's.

00:07:09:20 - 00:07:14:17
Steph
I'm impressed. There's a lot of blind spots in a van. You gotta, you gotta put that blinker on a long time before you

00:07:14:19 - 00:07:15:09
Kyle
Yeah.

00:07:15:09 - 00:07:15:27
Steph
another lane.

00:07:16:00 - 00:07:22:20
Kyle
Yeah. I recently got, like, a forerunner, and I call it like a boat. Like drives like a boat. I would imagine the vans the same way.

00:07:22:27 - 00:07:24:03
Steph
Yeah. I mean, it.

00:07:24:03 - 00:07:25:17
Steph
Doesn't handle like a Rav4.

00:07:25:19 - 00:07:26:04
Steph
Yeah, it's.

00:07:26:04 - 00:07:28:03
Steph
Not too sporty, but.

00:07:28:06 - 00:07:42:08
Kyle
With all this change, you know, change of pace and, like, change of location and now kind of like committing to almost full time van life, like, what does the word home mean to you right now?

00:07:42:11 - 00:07:42:16
Kyle
That's

00:07:42:17 - 00:07:50:29
Steph
really good question. When I think home, I think of my family and my sister's in Leavenworth.

00:07:50:29 - 00:07:52:17
Steph
And I do. I have spent a lot.

00:07:52:17 - 00:07:53:26
Steph
Of time in Leavenworth.

00:07:53:28 - 00:07:56:17
Steph
Sleeping in her spare room this year.

00:07:56:20 - 00:07:59:20
Steph
So that has become kind of like where I would go if I had to.

00:07:59:20 - 00:08:06:19
Steph
Go somewhere if my van broke down or if. Yeah, I got sick and needed to go somewhere for a while. I'd probably go to Leavenworth.

00:08:06:21 - 00:08:09:29
Steph
My stuff is in storage in Leavenworth. So I tell people.

00:08:09:29 - 00:08:15:14
Steph
I'm from Leavenworth, which is kind of a nice place in Washington. So I like saying that.

00:08:15:16 - 00:08:17:01
Steph
But home for me is surrounded by.

00:08:17:01 - 00:08:23:01
Steph
My family and, Yeah. And friends and I have a lot of friends in Washington.

00:08:23:01 - 00:08:24:01
Steph
As well, because I lived there.

00:08:24:01 - 00:08:24:12
Steph
For a

00:08:24:18 - 00:08:25:15
Kyle
decade.

00:08:25:17 - 00:08:26:27
Kyle
How old are your parents now?

00:08:27:00 - 00:08:29:01
Steph
76. My mom turned 76 today,

00:08:29:03 - 00:08:30:06
Kyle
know is happy birthday mom.

00:08:30:10 - 00:08:32:00
Steph
you a happy birthday. And she said she was having a.

00:08:32:00 - 00:08:34:20
Steph
Non birthday, so she didn't get

00:08:34:23 - 00:08:42:27
Kyle
Nice. Yeah. Their their origin story is funny or like listen to our podcast again. It's just like such a romantic romantic situation.

00:08:43:00 - 00:08:45:18
Steph
They knew each other for seven days and they're still together.

00:08:45:23 - 00:08:46:08
Kyle
that's awesome.

00:08:46:15 - 00:08:47:27
Steph
It's been, 51 years.

00:08:48:02 - 00:08:55:17
Kyle
Wow. Yeah. It's rare. What's the average? I think it's like, is it 60% divorce rate in America now?

00:08:55:19 - 00:08:57:09
Kyle
Yeah, it's probably pretty bad.

00:08:57:11 - 00:09:08:00
Kyle
Okay, so I want to talk about your site real quick. So, you know, back when we were talking, it was like trip reports, you know, you were pretty humble about, like, you know, I just put my stuff up there.

00:09:08:03 - 00:09:20:24
Kyle
It seems like you're taking it a bit more seriously. What were some of the updates you've done to it recently? And what is your vision for, like, what it can become or what it's going to become like? What what is this site that you're, you're envisioning?

00:09:21:00 - 00:09:25:24
Steph
Right. So I think since then I actually because I quit my job to take the boot.

00:09:25:24 - 00:09:26:18
Steph
Camp during that boot.

00:09:26:18 - 00:09:32:09
Steph
Camp time, I had a little bit more time and I, I use some my boot camp skills as well to rebuild my website from.

00:09:32:09 - 00:09:37:25
Steph
Scratch. I, you know, did that all myself through WordPress site and.

00:09:37:27 - 00:09:45:29
Steph
It had been previously like 18 different websites and it just way outgrown Google site capacity. And so now I have is a WordPress site which should.

00:09:45:29 - 00:09:50:12
Steph
Be way more searchable and everything a little more professional looking.

00:09:50:14 - 00:09:56:21
Steph
I mainly did that because I was just so frustrated with the the previous site and if this was my, you know, supposed life work.

00:09:56:21 - 00:09:59:15
Steph
That I had been working my whole life on, I wanted it to be something.

00:09:59:15 - 00:10:00:20
Steph
That could grow.

00:10:00:20 - 00:10:02:03
Steph
And that I liked.

00:10:02:05 - 00:10:04:04
Kyle
What were your frustrations?

00:10:04:07 - 00:10:13:18
Steph
I was just so it wasn't searchable. It was pretty old. HTML based. You're just very limited in what you could do with it.

00:10:13:20 - 00:10:14:26
Steph
Yeah. I'm still learning what I can do.

00:10:14:26 - 00:10:16:27
Steph
With the WordPress, but it's just there's.

00:10:16:27 - 00:10:18:00
Steph
So much more I can do.

00:10:18:00 - 00:10:19:19
Steph
With categories and tags.

00:10:19:19 - 00:10:22:11
Steph
And, you know, filters and stuff.

00:10:22:14 - 00:10:24:01
Steph
And database thing. I've created.

00:10:24:01 - 00:10:24:11
Steph
And.

00:10:24:13 - 00:10:26:03
Steph
My site is a giant database.

00:10:26:03 - 00:10:30:17
Steph
And so, yeah, I'm still, you know, still developing features of that.

00:10:30:19 - 00:10:36:07
Steph
But it can grow. That's the biggest thing is it should be able to grow. I have it on a server where it should be able to just keep growing.

00:10:36:07 - 00:10:37:24
Steph
And you know, it might be more server.

00:10:37:24 - 00:10:38:09
Steph
Space.

00:10:38:09 - 00:10:39:07
Steph
But

00:10:39:10 - 00:10:42:08
Kyle
Are you local server or are you like, you're buying servers?

00:10:42:11 - 00:10:48:07
Steph
server space. Yeah. I don't know how that works entirely, but I am. Yeah.

00:10:48:10 - 00:10:54:24
Steph
And so as far as what I, what I see in it, I it's always been the same for me. It's just, a place where I put trip reports.

00:10:54:24 - 00:10:56:06
Steph
And, I've.

00:10:56:06 - 00:10:57:22
Steph
Always taken it pretty seriously where I.

00:10:57:22 - 00:10:59:04
Steph
Want to put out, you know, good.

00:10:59:04 - 00:11:00:03
Steph
Beta. It's just over the.

00:11:00:03 - 00:11:04:07
Steph
Years, my my overlays and my my, maps and.

00:11:04:07 - 00:11:06:09
Steph
And just, you know, GPS stuff.

00:11:06:11 - 00:11:11:07
Steph
Hasn't improved. And so the ship reports have improved along with it. And sometimes.

00:11:11:07 - 00:11:12:21
Steph
I go back to an old trip report.

00:11:12:21 - 00:11:16:10
Steph
And redo the climb and remake the report and. Yeah.

00:11:16:12 - 00:11:32:29
Kyle
Yeah, I guess, talk to us about, like, sort of for someone who's maybe not familiar with your work and, like, what you've done, even though even if you're not familiar, you've you've definitely seen one of your topics, like an audience member. It's it's funny, I like, my buddy Phil was like, oh, I'm interviewing Steph a big like, you know, you've seen her topic.

00:11:32:29 - 00:11:50:20
Kyle
She's like, he's I don't know who that is. And I was like, oh, these hobos, you know what I mean? So what's your like, workflow? You know, because creating this content and like, creating these tacos and the trip reports, like, I would imagine at this point, after so many years, you if you have like a pretty specific workflow, it's like, stand here, take a picture here.

00:11:50:20 - 00:11:53:09
Kyle
It's like, what's that workflow like?

00:11:53:12 - 00:11:54:28
Steph
Oh, boy.

00:11:55:00 - 00:11:55:19
Steph
So you I make.

00:11:55:19 - 00:11:56:03
Steph
The overlay.

00:11:56:03 - 00:11:57:06
Steph
Before the client, I don't.

00:11:57:06 - 00:12:01:08
Steph
Know, some people are surprised to hear that, but I will try to make the overlay before the climb.

00:12:01:08 - 00:12:01:20
Steph
And then.

00:12:01:20 - 00:12:02:17
Steph
Afterwards tweak.

00:12:02:17 - 00:12:03:04
Steph
It. You know.

00:12:03:07 - 00:12:05:22
Steph
Correct it basically. So I will try to.

00:12:05:22 - 00:12:07:28
Steph
To make it. And that helps me.

00:12:08:01 - 00:12:10:20
Steph
Figure out what the routes are about to.

00:12:10:23 - 00:12:11:24
Steph
You know, how do I get down?

00:12:11:24 - 00:12:13:15
Steph
Because I've already figured out how to get down.

00:12:13:15 - 00:12:16:10
Steph
You know, I know that. So,

00:12:16:13 - 00:12:17:18
Kyle
Are you taking your own picture?

00:12:17:21 - 00:12:18:17
Steph
Yes.

00:12:18:19 - 00:12:21:05
Kyle
With a dSLR mirrorless camera or cell phone?

00:12:21:08 - 00:12:21:27
Steph
just a cell

00:12:22:00 - 00:12:22:15
Kyle
Wow.

00:12:22:21 - 00:12:23:04
Kyle
Cool

00:12:23:07 - 00:12:32:06
Steph
cell phone's pretty good. Sometimes in that that pre overlay process, I don't have the photo for it, so I'll just go find something or I'll just make the overlay without a photo.

00:12:32:06 - 00:12:41:25
Steph
And then I know exactly where I need to take the photo from. And so yeah, I'm always kind of looking for that opportunity on a, on an approach or a descent or something to take that photo.

00:12:41:27 - 00:12:42:17
Steph
Or in a previous.

00:12:42:17 - 00:12:45:17
Steph
Climb, you know, oh, I'm going to climb Cloud Tower over there. So I'm going to go take.

00:12:45:17 - 00:12:47:07
Steph
A photo of for the future.

00:12:47:10 - 00:12:47:24
Steph
You know.

00:12:47:24 - 00:12:48:02
Steph
So

00:12:48:08 - 00:12:53:19
Kyle
I like that foresight because I think that's one of the biggest things with your Topaz that I love is like you pick the perfect perspective

00:12:53:19 - 00:12:53:29
Steph
Oh,

00:12:54:03 - 00:13:00:10
Kyle
to capture like the whole route and the lighting's usually really good. Like you, you do a really have great I

00:13:00:13 - 00:13:02:04
Steph
you, I try sometimes.

00:13:02:04 - 00:13:09:09
Steph
Google Earth is actually pretty good at having. There are some areas where Google Earth has almost a photo quality image.

00:13:09:09 - 00:13:09:27
Steph
And so I.

00:13:09:27 - 00:13:12:05
Steph
Have a couple of my temples, especially from like.

00:13:12:05 - 00:13:14:20
Steph
Zion, or a couple in Yosemite.

00:13:14:20 - 00:13:14:25
Steph
Where.

00:13:14:25 - 00:13:18:23
Steph
They're based on a Google Earth image, and it's it's pretty wild. Yeah.

00:13:18:26 - 00:13:24:24
Steph
So I'm hoping as, as, the technology increases maybe or betters, I will be able to,

00:13:24:27 - 00:13:25:16
Steph
Do that more.

00:13:25:16 - 00:13:30:10
Steph
For areas that are just hard to get the right angle. There's just some peaks where you can't really get to the.

00:13:30:10 - 00:13:31:22
Steph
Position for a good overlay.

00:13:31:25 - 00:13:32:16
Steph
So

00:13:32:19 - 00:13:37:15
Kyle
That's one gripe I have with Red Rock, Google Earth. It's like terrible. It's terrible.

00:13:37:17 - 00:13:48:25
Kyle
Yeah I know right. Yeah. It's like it's almost like flat. It's like it's not it doesn't have the structure that most other places have. That's interesting. Yeah. And so continue your workflow.

00:13:49:00 - 00:13:52:28
Steph
So I, I make the overlay before the climb, I research it.

00:13:53:01 - 00:13:56:22
Steph
And we, we do the climb, and I'm just always taking photos, but yet trying.

00:13:56:22 - 00:14:04:10
Steph
To make it not, the something that slows down the day or annoys the partner or anything. I.

00:14:04:13 - 00:14:16:19
Steph
I've gotten really used to just, like pulling up the camera, taking photos back in the pocket so that, yeah, I'll take like 200, 300 photos during a day and my partner will have thought I took about ten. So I'm like, yes, I was, successful in.

00:14:16:21 - 00:14:27:25
Steph
You know, not not making the day all about the photos. And so I like to document it as we go. It's just become second nature at this point. I have my camera on a tether.

00:14:27:25 - 00:14:29:07
Steph
And it's kind of attached.

00:14:29:07 - 00:14:33:24
Steph
To my harness, and, like, it's like in a snack pack or something attached to my harness, just.

00:14:33:24 - 00:14:34:19
Steph
Like a piece of gear.

00:14:34:19 - 00:14:37:20
Steph
So, you know, it's the same motion to pull up the camera as.

00:14:37:20 - 00:14:39:21
Steph
It is to.

00:14:39:23 - 00:14:43:00
Steph
You know, place a cam. So I'll take photos on lead.

00:14:43:02 - 00:14:59:08
Kyle
besides, at the ballet's, you know, the budgets and at the top is shooting down on the top rope. What other positions can you take pictures of during the climb that like would heighten, you know, because I mean, I, I'm kind of asking for myself, I guess.

00:14:59:08 - 00:15:00:24
Steph
Yeah. Like during the pitch sometimes.

00:15:00:24 - 00:15:05:20
Steph
Yeah. It's just kind of interesting to see like a during the pitch photo or just looking out this way it looks like. But

00:15:05:22 - 00:15:12:15
Kyle
Like a shoot shooting up or like the surroundings. Like, what's the subject of the shot? If you're mid-late like a selfie or

00:15:12:18 - 00:15:27:12
Steph
I find that, you know, shooting up is what's going to be most useful to a leader or to someone who's trying to navigate the route. People do mention they appreciate the pitch by pitch photos, and, you know, what they're appreciated is like looking up at the pitch. And this is what it is just to.

00:15:27:12 - 00:15:32:10
Steph
Kind of keep them on route. You know, it's not bolted anchors everywhere. You know.

00:15:32:10 - 00:15:48:12
Steph
Red rocks has a lot of roots, just bolted anchors. So it's pretty obvious where you stop and where the next pitches, but it's not always the case. I try to, I try to avoid, like, a pure butt shot and just kind of, like, tilt the camera back a bit, get a wide angle, and it kind of looks more dynamic.

00:15:48:12 - 00:15:50:17
Steph
Just as the is taking off.

00:15:50:20 - 00:15:53:04
Steph
Get more of a full person in the shot.

00:15:53:06 - 00:16:00:07
Kyle
Nice. Cool. So it's just like I, it's almost like you said, second nature. You're just like, here it is. Here it is.

00:16:00:10 - 00:16:03:12
Steph
And then we get back from the climb and pretty much the first thing I do.

00:16:03:12 - 00:16:05:25
Steph
Is download the photos, crawl into my.

00:16:05:28 - 00:16:06:10
Steph
Used to be.

00:16:06:10 - 00:16:07:16
Steph
Rav4, not my van.

00:16:07:16 - 00:16:17:09
Steph
And, pretty much write the trip for it. So I'll go see the photos. I'll take them by the pitch they were taken on because that's, you know, that's something that's going to.

00:16:17:09 - 00:16:18:07
Steph
Flee my mind pretty.

00:16:18:07 - 00:16:19:10
Steph
Quickly is what pitch was.

00:16:19:10 - 00:16:22:19
Steph
At on. Because sometimes I'm looking up sometimes and looking down.

00:16:22:19 - 00:16:26:14
Steph
So it could be either the pitch above or the pitch below.

00:16:26:16 - 00:16:26:23
Steph
So I.

00:16:26:23 - 00:16:27:24
Steph
Do that, I take them.

00:16:27:24 - 00:16:28:09
Steph
And then I.

00:16:28:09 - 00:16:30:08
Steph
Select my favorites that kind of represent the.

00:16:30:08 - 00:16:35:16
Steph
Day, you know, put those up on my, my website, put them on the.

00:16:35:16 - 00:16:40:10
Steph
Trip report, write the captions, click the time stats, the time stats I get.

00:16:40:10 - 00:16:42:15
Steph
From my time stamps on my photos.

00:16:42:15 - 00:16:44:08
Steph
So if I take a photo at the.

00:16:44:08 - 00:16:52:20
Steph
Beginning of the route when we top out, you know that's those things. That's what I get the time for. So how long it took to climb there out or what? Whatnot.

00:16:52:23 - 00:17:02:13
Kyle
How granular do you get with the information on the pitches, like movement, clock speed? Like, what's, what chapters or what, like segments of information do you want to communicate?

00:17:02:18 - 00:17:04:16
Steph
more of a Fred Becky approach is go up the.

00:17:04:16 - 00:17:06:17
Steph
Crack, you know,

00:17:06:19 - 00:17:08:01
Steph
you know, figure it out.

00:17:08:04 - 00:17:09:06
Steph
There's some adventure involved.

00:17:09:12 - 00:17:09:18
Steph
And.

00:17:09:18 - 00:17:11:22
Steph
Everyone's going to do it differently, especially if there's a cracks like.

00:17:11:22 - 00:17:15:01
Steph
Who knows how some people are going to do it. Yeah. Like getting in.

00:17:15:01 - 00:17:15:24
Steph
The Harding slot.

00:17:15:24 - 00:17:24:26
Steph
I've seen it done two different ways. And, you know, I don't want to tell someone the way I did it, because it probably wouldn't work for them, you know? So,

00:17:24:28 - 00:17:25:18
Steph
Yeah, I tend.

00:17:25:18 - 00:17:27:05
Steph
To be more cut.

00:17:27:05 - 00:17:33:00
Steph
And dry with the, the details. Maybe mention if there's a bolt, you're there. Head left, head right in that.

00:17:33:00 - 00:17:35:07
Steph
Kind of thing.

00:17:35:09 - 00:17:37:01
Steph
Yeah, I kind of the photos do the work.

00:17:37:01 - 00:17:38:01
Steph
For the most part.

00:17:38:04 - 00:17:39:16
Steph
Just very photo heavy trip.

00:17:39:16 - 00:17:40:23
Steph
Reports.

00:17:40:25 - 00:18:02:06
Kyle
During all this time like why. Like what has kept you going. Like why is this a passion for you. Because you know, like it seems like it's been a very I don't know, I don't want to say thankless, but like selfless. It's like it's a lot of extra work to a climb. You know, climbing is already kind of complicated, and you've got to do a bunch of stuff and like, you're literally getting back from the climb.

00:18:02:06 - 00:18:11:21
Kyle
And most people are like, probably like, oh, I get to the cooler and, you know, have a couple beers and chat with friends and you're just like, crunching right away. What what about the process? Do you love.

00:18:11:23 - 00:18:13:28
Steph
Everything. I don't know, I just.

00:18:14:01 - 00:18:16:08
Steph
I love it all. I love how how full it makes.

00:18:16:08 - 00:18:17:01
Steph
A climb and how.

00:18:17:01 - 00:18:23:02
Steph
Memorable it is. Like, I can remember the climb because I've. I've so fully detailed it out.

00:18:23:04 - 00:18:23:23
Steph
I can remember.

00:18:23:23 - 00:18:24:25
Steph
Details about it.

00:18:24:25 - 00:18:27:14
Steph
Years down the road.

00:18:27:17 - 00:18:31:03
Steph
It's just a fuller experience. And I think because I'm climbing all the time, because at least.

00:18:31:04 - 00:18:33:26
Steph
You know, now I'm, I'm this is what I do, and I'm, I'm.

00:18:33:26 - 00:18:35:06
Steph
Jobless. I view it as.

00:18:35:06 - 00:18:37:07
Steph
You know, my what I can do and my work.

00:18:37:07 - 00:18:39:20
Steph
What it what how I can contribute to the climbing.

00:18:39:20 - 00:18:41:22
Steph
Community. And I can still.

00:18:41:22 - 00:18:42:00
Steph
Have.

00:18:42:00 - 00:18:43:06
Steph
Fun and play.

00:18:43:06 - 00:18:44:17
Steph
And be out there climbing. But I can be.

00:18:44:17 - 00:18:51:14
Steph
Also generating useful information and going, you know, a step further. I feel like it kind of gives me a.

00:18:51:14 - 00:18:52:10
Steph
Purpose to what I do.

00:18:52:15 - 00:19:16:27
Kyle
Nice do you feel like this process of documenting these climbs in this way has taught you or like you've you've gained skills in other areas, like because for for example, for me, with my my piece of content, I've actually kind of realized recently that, the, the act of going through and rewatching the footage and like, editing the footage, I'm reliving the climb in a way.

00:19:16:29 - 00:19:36:02
Kyle
And even if I watch the re-edited, like the edited video, I'm like, I'm there, I'm immersed, I'm climbing that pitch again. And so, I feel like it's helped me with technique. It's helped me analyze my movement. And so there's like this weird second benefit to the process of creating this content in the first place. It's like actually making me a better climber in a weird way.

00:19:36:04 - 00:19:38:06
Kyle
Is there any parallels to to what you're doing?

00:19:38:08 - 00:19:39:18
Steph
Yeah, I agree with that.

00:19:39:20 - 00:19:41:26
Steph
I, I don't want to epic. I don't want my time.

00:19:41:26 - 00:19:44:02
Steph
Stats to be slow.

00:19:44:05 - 00:19:51:03
Steph
I yeah, I just, I'm embarrassed by any kind of epics, I guess that I might have. And so it, it.

00:19:51:03 - 00:19:54:24
Steph
Kind of somewhat prevents that. Somewhat.

00:19:54:24 - 00:19:56:25
Steph
It's, you know, based on whatever kind.

00:19:56:25 - 00:20:03:07
Steph
Of conditions or weather or issues you might face that day, depending on, like, you might not go as fast as you think you can go.

00:20:03:07 - 00:20:03:23
Steph
Just because.

00:20:03:23 - 00:20:05:17
Steph
There's something that happens.

00:20:05:20 - 00:20:06:08
Steph
And you can't let.

00:20:06:08 - 00:20:07:10
Steph
That make.

00:20:07:10 - 00:20:09:28
Steph
You stressed out or.

00:20:10:00 - 00:20:14:02
Steph
I don't know, you're anxious on the climb or something. You'll I'm not going to get a good time for.

00:20:14:02 - 00:20:22:08
Steph
My trip report. Oh, I can't take the time stats because it's going to look bad, but I don't do that. But it certainly makes me want to to nail the route.

00:20:22:08 - 00:20:28:19
Steph
And to to perform well on it and to. Yeah, have a good showing out there.

00:20:28:22 - 00:20:33:02
Steph
Also just I've become quite aware of like.

00:20:33:04 - 00:20:34:22
Steph
The, the.

00:20:34:25 - 00:20:35:10
Steph
The ideal.

00:20:35:10 - 00:20:39:22
Steph
Rope to bring you know, do we bring twin ropes, do we bring a.

00:20:39:22 - 00:20:49:10
Steph
70. Do we bring a 62. Bring an 80. Do we bring a tagline? Do we haul, you know, all those kinds of things. I've, I've those details have become really important.

00:20:49:13 - 00:20:51:21
Steph
Just because I'm documenting them.

00:20:51:23 - 00:20:56:28
Kyle
And there's other people taking what you say to heart and like actually making decisions. Yeah.

00:20:56:29 - 00:20:57:15
Kyle
I want to,

00:20:57:18 - 00:21:00:00
Steph
you know, take the wrong and nothing's wrong, but.

00:21:00:00 - 00:21:01:19
Steph
Like, to take.

00:21:01:22 - 00:21:04:29
Steph
The, the subpar,

00:21:05:02 - 00:21:06:00
Steph
Setup,

00:21:06:02 - 00:21:17:11
Kyle
what if you like go on a route and you realize like, the gear that you brought necessarily wasn't optimized. Do you, do you like, like recommend? Based on my experience, here's my recommended thing.

00:21:17:17 - 00:21:18:05
Steph
started to do that.

00:21:18:05 - 00:21:20:13
Steph
More and more. That I will mention.

00:21:20:13 - 00:21:25:19
Steph
Here's the rack. We brought, but we wanted a for like so the other day I actually clean ginger cracks to Blade.

00:21:25:19 - 00:21:28:02
Steph
Runner and the rack recommended.

00:21:28:05 - 00:21:29:04
Steph
I think it was like a single.

00:21:29:04 - 00:21:30:10
Steph
Rack to three.

00:21:30:12 - 00:21:32:04
Steph
Or something like that, or something to three.

00:21:32:04 - 00:21:32:29
Steph
And one.

00:21:32:29 - 00:21:33:25
Steph
Three was what it.

00:21:33:25 - 00:21:35:18
Steph
Recommended in the, in all.

00:21:35:18 - 00:21:36:00
Steph
The sauce.

00:21:36:00 - 00:21:38:04
Steph
The beater. And I actually would have wanted.

00:21:38:06 - 00:21:39:00
Steph
Either two threes.

00:21:39:00 - 00:21:39:24
Steph
Or a three and a four.

00:21:39:24 - 00:21:42:17
Steph
And typically if if there's a choice there, I would probably.

00:21:42:17 - 00:21:43:15
Steph
Just bring the three in the four.

00:21:43:15 - 00:21:45:00
Steph
For the variety.

00:21:45:02 - 00:21:48:12
Steph
And so that was where a place where I, my, my,

00:21:48:14 - 00:21:51:29
Steph
Yeah, my trip report I mentioned here's a rack we brought, but I would probably.

00:21:51:29 - 00:21:54:24
Steph
Bring a for another three if I did again.

00:21:55:00 - 00:22:01:17
Kyle
Nice out here in Red Rock. I think the gear beat is pretty sandbagged in general, at least for me.

00:22:01:20 - 00:22:03:06
Steph
the other day we, I learned from.

00:22:03:06 - 00:22:09:01
Steph
That and I was like, okay, I'm going to bring more in the next time. And then I was like, okay, single rack was good. You know? That was for Fiddler on the roof.

00:22:09:01 - 00:22:12:28
Steph
It recommended a single rack to two. And so he brought a double reacted to and we had.

00:22:13:03 - 00:22:16:07
Steph
Double as much stuff as we needed. You just can't place gear on there.

00:22:16:10 - 00:22:20:29
Kyle
And you can't. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've always. It's better to have too much and then too little.

00:22:21:01 - 00:22:21:24
Steph
Maybe.

00:22:21:27 - 00:22:26:01
Steph
Except when you're, you're being buffeted by the wind and you've got all this extra weight on.

00:22:26:01 - 00:22:28:08
Steph
You thing thrown around and. Yeah,

00:22:28:10 - 00:22:45:12
Kyle
Fair enough. What about so the site itself, you said, like, with this new update, like you, I think you said that you've seen a lot more traffic. Or is that based on just your awareness to it or have, like, the site upgrades literally drawn more people to your site? Now.

00:22:45:14 - 00:22:49:26
Steph
I'm not sure. I've seen much more traffic on my website, but I think.

00:22:49:28 - 00:22:51:02
Steph
Along with rebuilding my.

00:22:51:02 - 00:22:54:01
Steph
Website, I also started an Instagram account. So I actually.

00:22:54:01 - 00:22:56:10
Steph
Didn't have Instagram until like a year ago or

00:22:56:10 - 00:22:56:15
Kyle
so.

00:22:56:17 - 00:23:01:07
Kyle
Really? Yeah. Oh weird. Okay, that's the switch.

00:23:01:10 - 00:23:16:29
Steph
I wasn't active at all. I had maybe I had an Instagram account that I never posted. And then I renamed it. So not sure what the history of my Instagram account set is, but I didn't start it until a year ago. And I started posting when I made a trip report, and I post.

00:23:17:02 - 00:23:18:10
Steph
The overlay in like nine other.

00:23:18:10 - 00:23:19:15
Steph
Photos because it limits you to.

00:23:19:15 - 00:23:21:04
Steph
Ten. And I had posts.

00:23:21:04 - 00:23:22:01
Steph
Like the blurb.

00:23:22:01 - 00:23:24:04
Steph
That came along with the intro of the climb.

00:23:24:07 - 00:23:30:04
Steph
And that started to give me a lot more attention. Maybe not exactly to my website, but to the actual existence.

00:23:30:04 - 00:23:36:03
Steph
Of my trip reports and what I was doing. And yeah, that certainly has brought a lot more attention

00:23:36:06 - 00:23:36:13
Kyle
to it.

00:23:36:17 - 00:23:50:01
Kyle
Cool. How are you? Like, I don't know, managing that on the back end. Like, is the traffic costing you more money? Like, is it, is it just a subscription base for your site? Because I, my site, I run on traffic. So the more people see it, the more I pay.

00:23:50:04 - 00:23:50:22
Steph
No.

00:23:50:26 - 00:23:55:06
Steph
So that's that's an interesting question because I had thought to.

00:23:55:08 - 00:23:58:24
Steph
Actually run a subscription on my website. Post made an Instagram.

00:23:58:24 - 00:24:00:12
Steph
Post like half a year ago.

00:24:00:19 - 00:24:03:13
Steph
And the you was.

00:24:03:15 - 00:24:05:15
Steph
Quite a bit in favor of making a subscription that.

00:24:05:15 - 00:24:10:14
Steph
People were willing to pay. You know, whatever I was going to charge per year, 25, 50, you know, whatever.

00:24:10:14 - 00:24:13:25
Steph
It was per year. And I decided not to. I couldn't.

00:24:13:25 - 00:24:16:23
Steph
Do it. I just it's always been free, and I, I just couldn't.

00:24:16:23 - 00:24:17:16
Steph
Put a subscription.

00:24:17:19 - 00:24:19:15
Steph
Subscription on it.

00:24:19:17 - 00:24:22:25
Steph
And I think, you know, people will say they'll pay, but when it comes.

00:24:22:25 - 00:24:24:22
Steph
Down to it, it's not going to be everyone.

00:24:24:28 - 00:24:26:08
Steph
Who says it that well.

00:24:26:11 - 00:24:31:01
Steph
And that's just human nature. So no,

00:24:31:03 - 00:24:33:06
Steph
The amount of traffic I get doesn't affect.

00:24:33:06 - 00:24:41:08
Steph
The amount I get at all. I have website fees, and I, I, you know, I just pay them whatever they are. Yeah. And I have a donation button.

00:24:41:08 - 00:24:46:21
Steph
So, you know, people can do that subscription if they want a self-imposed subscription, but.

00:24:46:24 - 00:24:55:27
Kyle
what what about, what about it. Can you not do like, why is it something you're hesitant to even if people are saying that they're willing to and they support that?

00:24:55:29 - 00:24:56:06
Kyle
I

00:24:56:06 - 00:25:01:26
Steph
don't I can't really, articulate it.

00:25:01:28 - 00:25:02:18
Steph
I'm not sure.

00:25:02:18 - 00:25:03:09
Steph
I would pay a.

00:25:03:09 - 00:25:04:26
Steph
Subscription to a climbing.

00:25:04:26 - 00:25:23:26
Steph
Website, especially if the overlays were on Mountain Project and that was another thought. You know, if I charge a subscription for my website, I feel like I'd have to pull my overlays off Mountain project, which is not what I wanted to do. I, I like Mountain Project. It's a great service and I, I feel like it's also.

00:25:23:26 - 00:25:26:09
Steph
Helpful to me and my overlays on the mountain project, because.

00:25:26:09 - 00:25:27:11
Steph
I feel like that's how a lot.

00:25:27:11 - 00:25:39:06
Steph
Of people actually find my stuff and use my stuff. And you know who I am? Maybe they never have gone to my website, but they use my overlays. And so I like having them on Mountain Project, and I didn't want to have to.

00:25:39:06 - 00:25:41:05
Steph
Pull those off. And then I realized that if I was.

00:25:41:05 - 00:25:46:26
Steph
Charging on my website and they were free Mountain project, you know, like I.

00:25:47:01 - 00:25:56:04
Steph
Personally wouldn't pay, so I couldn't do it. I just, I couldn't do it. So I was thinking of other ways to, to make money because currently I don't even make enough to pay the website fees.

00:25:56:04 - 00:25:58:17
Steph
I know I pay for my website.

00:25:58:19 - 00:25:59:25
Steph
And so the donation buttons.

00:25:59:25 - 00:26:01:01
Steph
There, and.

00:26:01:01 - 00:26:02:05
Steph
Also just starting.

00:26:02:05 - 00:26:08:18
Steph
This book and book of my favorite climbs, and that's going to be my attempt to try to make money off what I do.

00:26:08:21 - 00:26:30:05
Kyle
I'm sure you've thought of this already, but have you thought of like a a tiered system, like kind of like a magazine where you can read half of it or a quarter of it or you know, you get the topos. You don't have to take that off mountain project. But then if you really want the whole experience, the breadth of work that you create, you have to be a supporting member of your community.

00:26:30:08 - 00:26:32:13
Kyle
Are you opposed to that kind of structure to it?

00:26:32:14 - 00:26:49:12
Steph
I I've thought about it. It would be a little bit of reworking on my part of my website, which I could do. I don't know, I just I'm not sure I can charge for the information part of it. Too little stressful to me to charge because all of a sudden I'm like, I have to be 110% correct on every single piece of information.

00:26:49:15 - 00:26:52:09
Steph
And yeah, I might be 110%.

00:26:52:09 - 00:26:54:08
Steph
Correct on an on on.

00:26:54:10 - 00:26:56:04
Steph
A trip report. But then as time.

00:26:56:04 - 00:26:58:18
Steph
Goes on, it's not going to be correct anymore. You know, bolts.

00:26:58:18 - 00:27:04:24
Steph
Might be dropped, anchors might be put in. It's just I feel like that.

00:27:04:26 - 00:27:05:15
Steph
That.

00:27:05:17 - 00:27:07:19
Steph
Incorrectness of old trip report to.

00:27:07:19 - 00:27:10:23
Steph
Get to me and I couldn't just I couldn't.

00:27:10:25 - 00:27:12:20
Steph
Feel good about charging for it. So

00:27:12:25 - 00:27:13:26
Kyle
what about ads.

00:27:13:28 - 00:27:24:12
Steph
I thought of that too. And I can't stand adds summit post might be a good example of a site you go to and you're just bombarded with ads and you have to click.

00:27:24:12 - 00:27:28:09
Steph
Through them and wait, some number of time and then click.

00:27:28:11 - 00:27:33:28
Steph
Multiple times to get to the actual post. And I, I just, I can't do it. So.

00:27:34:00 - 00:27:34:27
Steph
You know, I'll.

00:27:34:29 - 00:27:36:02
Steph
I'll, live in my.

00:27:36:02 - 00:27:38:07
Steph
Van and do what I do. And when I run out of money.

00:27:38:07 - 00:27:41:22
Steph
Then it was just because I didn't charge a subscription.

00:27:41:24 - 00:28:00:16
Kyle
Well, I mean, that's, just generous and kind of you, I think in, in today's world, everything you turn left, you turn right, and you get charged left and right. And, it's just the economy that is today. Especially in the climbing world, it's like there's no money to squeeze out of anybody anyway. And so,

00:28:00:19 - 00:28:04:14
Kyle
Yeah, it's tough. But what you're doing is really awesome. So.

00:28:04:16 - 00:28:06:15
Steph
just look for other ways to make money here.

00:28:06:18 - 00:28:07:07
Steph
Try.

00:28:07:10 - 00:28:24:28
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00:29:20:00 - 00:29:34:20
Kyle
What about some of your adventures recently, your climbing adventures. It seems like you've been climbing a lot, like red rocks. Eye on Yosemite. You just got back from Spain. Talk to me about what you've been doing.

00:29:34:28 - 00:29:35:08
Kyle
Yeah,

00:29:35:11 - 00:29:39:18
Steph
Yeah. So, that all began a couple of years ago.

00:29:39:21 - 00:29:40:06
Steph
When I kind.

00:29:40:06 - 00:29:41:16
Steph
Of just, didn't have the.

00:29:41:16 - 00:29:46:04
Steph
Job and moved into my Rav four, and then eventually, rented out my.

00:29:46:04 - 00:29:51:26
Steph
Place in a park. So I got a renter last fall, and that's that's kind of what I was like. Okay, I'm definitely excited.

00:29:51:29 - 00:29:52:18
Steph
I moved all.

00:29:52:18 - 00:29:53:19
Steph
My stuff to.

00:29:53:20 - 00:29:55:17
Steph
To Leavenworth, put.

00:29:55:17 - 00:29:58:29
Steph
In a storage unit. And that was September of 2025.

00:29:58:29 - 00:30:04:10
Steph
And then I just went on the road and I kind of went on a climbing fiesta and,

00:30:04:12 - 00:30:10:00
Steph
Let's see where I go. I went to the Valley, stayed there for a number of weeks and climbed the list up there.

00:30:10:02 - 00:30:10:25
Steph
And then moved.

00:30:10:25 - 00:30:12:22
Steph
On to Red rocks and hit like.

00:30:12:22 - 00:30:13:02
Steph
An.

00:30:13:02 - 00:30:13:23
Steph
Epic week of.

00:30:13:23 - 00:30:14:14
Steph
Rain.

00:30:14:17 - 00:30:16:02
Steph
Just epic. Everything was.

00:30:16:02 - 00:30:16:12
Steph
What?

00:30:16:12 - 00:30:19:22
Steph
I couldn't believe it, but I was stubborn. I was just like, guys, it's going to be.

00:30:19:22 - 00:30:25:04
Steph
Dry tomorrow, it's going to be dry tomorrow. And I waited for like ten days and climb some limestone. And that was fun.

00:30:25:06 - 00:30:28:20
Steph
The limestone was definitely fun. Kind of went to Zion for a bit because it had been.

00:30:28:20 - 00:30:30:18
Steph
Drier down there, climb there, and then came.

00:30:30:18 - 00:30:32:15
Steph
Back to Red rocks. So I spent a good.

00:30:32:15 - 00:30:34:09
Steph
Time, good amount of time in Red rocks.

00:30:34:09 - 00:30:34:20
Steph
Last.

00:30:34:20 - 00:30:38:05
Steph
Fall. And in Zion. I have a number of roots,

00:30:38:08 - 00:30:39:29
Kyle
What were some standouts in Yosemite?

00:30:40:02 - 00:30:46:26
Steph
in Yosemite last fall and Yosemite. What did I claim?

00:30:46:29 - 00:30:57:25
Steph
Six. I will say, I had climbed it before, but that was one of my first Yosemite roots. If not the first, it might have been the first Yosemite I did back in 2007.

00:30:57:27 - 00:30:58:25
Steph
And I had not.

00:30:58:25 - 00:30:59:25
Steph
Led a single pitch.

00:30:59:25 - 00:31:05:10
Steph
On it, and I'd always wanted to come back and, you know, lead the whole thing or, you know, just just climb it and lead.

00:31:05:10 - 00:31:07:20
Steph
A lot of it. And just this time I let go.

00:31:07:20 - 00:31:08:25
Steph
Thing it was it's awesome.

00:31:08:25 - 00:31:11:08
Kyle
Nice. Congrats. Yeah.

00:31:11:10 - 00:31:11:24
Steph
Yeah.

00:31:11:24 - 00:31:12:28
Steph
And such a good day out.

00:31:12:28 - 00:31:14:01
Steph
It's a long day and I.

00:31:14:03 - 00:31:14:16
Steph
Love that.

00:31:14:16 - 00:31:15:28
Steph
Part about it where you've.

00:31:15:28 - 00:31:18:14
Steph
Got that, you know, we got to get to the summit before dark.

00:31:18:14 - 00:31:22:10
Steph
And we got this descent ahead of us. So. Yeah. So that was pretty awesome.

00:31:22:10 - 00:31:22:19
Kyle
Would you.

00:31:22:19 - 00:31:23:07
Kyle
Climb it with.

00:31:23:10 - 00:31:25:10
Steph
Guy named Brook.

00:31:25:12 - 00:31:28:13
Steph
Yeah. Just a gal that I had.

00:31:28:15 - 00:31:30:28
Steph
Instagram message, I guess. And we ended up.

00:31:30:28 - 00:31:31:16
Steph
Connecting for.

00:31:31:16 - 00:31:35:29
Steph
That. And then we climbed another route together. Yeah. Lots of fun.

00:31:36:01 - 00:31:38:07
Steph
I climb Serenity Sons with with another.

00:31:38:10 - 00:31:38:15
Steph
Guy.

00:31:38:15 - 00:31:40:12
Steph
Named Shay. She's actually from Vegas.

00:31:40:13 - 00:31:41:12
Kyle
Shane McRae.

00:31:41:15 - 00:31:45:05
Steph
Okay? Yeah. She's cool. Yeah. And, we've kept in touch. We're going.

00:31:45:05 - 00:31:47:03
Steph
To get together hopefully later this year. She's out of the.

00:31:47:03 - 00:31:49:04
Steph
Country right now. Or will be,

00:31:49:06 - 00:31:52:27
Kyle
Yeah. I saw her comment on your most recent post. Is that good? Let's go on an adventure.

00:31:52:29 - 00:31:56:21
Steph
yeah. And so we plan to again. So yeah we had Clint serenity sense

00:31:56:26 - 00:31:57:21
Kyle
that Robert's really good.

00:31:57:26 - 00:31:59:21
Steph
It's so fun. Yeah. It's just pure fun.

00:31:59:21 - 00:32:01:14
Kyle
Super good.

00:32:01:17 - 00:32:02:03
Kyle
Yeah

00:32:02:06 - 00:32:06:07
Steph
I think the upper pitches, since yesterday were put up by.

00:32:06:07 - 00:32:07:00
Steph
Clint Cummins.

00:32:07:00 - 00:32:08:02
Steph
Who is.

00:32:08:04 - 00:32:09:03
Steph
My mentor.

00:32:09:03 - 00:32:09:23
Steph
Basically.

00:32:09:23 - 00:32:14:26
Steph
You know, back in 2005, I met him and,

00:32:14:28 - 00:32:21:18
Steph
Yeah, he kind of took me under his wing a bit and showed me the tricks. And, he came to Washington for a few seasons in.

00:32:21:18 - 00:32:30:22
Steph
A row, and we did, like, the North road to Baker and Liberty Crack and Prospect Park, you know? So it was kind of where I learned how to climb or learn how to drag, climb

00:32:30:24 - 00:32:31:21
Kyle
That's cool. All

00:32:31:22 - 00:32:32:07
Steph
the stuff.

00:32:32:12 - 00:32:39:15
Kyle
it must be now. I'd be ready to just climb a route that he's done. Revisit that a little bit. It was.

00:32:39:18 - 00:32:41:00
Steph
other highlights.

00:32:41:00 - 00:32:41:29
Steph
I mean.

00:32:42:01 - 00:32:45:01
Steph
Oh, yeah. So climbed.

00:32:45:04 - 00:32:47:24
Steph
The adult run, which I'd always wanted to do that I.

00:32:47:24 - 00:32:50:24
Steph
Let it, just kind of it gives you a good sense of, okay.

00:32:50:24 - 00:32:53:17
Steph
What's my nighttime going to be if I go about leading that thing?

00:32:53:24 - 00:32:57:00
Steph
And I did pretty well despite, taking my biggest whipper.

00:32:57:00 - 00:32:58:07
Steph
Of my life on on the.

00:32:58:07 - 00:32:58:27
Steph
Second pitch.

00:32:58:27 - 00:33:00:08
Steph
When,

00:33:00:11 - 00:33:01:10
Steph
An offset cam blew.

00:33:01:10 - 00:33:03:28
Steph
Out of a pin scar and then the next one blew.

00:33:04:01 - 00:33:05:22
Steph
And so I, I went for quite the.

00:33:05:22 - 00:33:07:23
Steph
Ride and landed on my head. So.

00:33:07:25 - 00:33:09:20
Steph
Yeah, kind of shredded my.

00:33:09:20 - 00:33:12:06
Steph
Shirt and, cracked my helmet and.

00:33:12:08 - 00:33:13:04
Kyle
wow,

00:33:13:04 - 00:33:16:04
Steph
probably what was a concussion, but, kept going, so.

00:33:16:11 - 00:33:17:05
Kyle
Holy shit.

00:33:17:08 - 00:33:17:16
Steph
Yeah.

00:33:17:18 - 00:33:20:15
Kyle
Were you French freeing? I mean, free climbing.

00:33:20:18 - 00:33:22:23
Steph
I was in eight hours on that pitch.

00:33:22:25 - 00:33:23:08
Kyle
Okay.

00:33:23:10 - 00:33:23:20
Steph
Yeah.

00:33:23:26 - 00:33:25:15
Steph
That was, you know, I was we were doing the.

00:33:25:15 - 00:33:27:05
Steph
Adult run in, like, Nyad.

00:33:27:05 - 00:33:30:18
Steph
Style. This is how we're going to do it. And what we think is that the trigger.

00:33:30:18 - 00:33:31:00
Steph
On the.

00:33:31:00 - 00:33:31:15
Steph
Offset.

00:33:31:15 - 00:33:32:28
Steph
Cam, it was the next.

00:33:32:28 - 00:33:36:14
Steph
Four kind of got pushed up against the pin scar and actually.

00:33:36:14 - 00:33:38:03
Steph
Uncon the cam.

00:33:38:06 - 00:33:40:10
Steph
Because I ended up placing the same exact cam.

00:33:40:10 - 00:33:44:09
Steph
The second time up. And it was like how that thing blew out. But that's kind of what we think happened.

00:33:44:11 - 00:33:46:09
Kyle
Holy shit. And what happened to the second one?

00:33:46:11 - 00:33:46:24
Kyle
The Blue

00:33:47:01 - 00:33:52:18
Steph
I it's there's probably not it was a good of a cam. I didn't really inspect that one. Or the same thing could have happened.

00:33:52:18 - 00:33:55:15
Steph
They're both for, offsets, which I love.

00:33:55:15 - 00:33:56:08
Steph
Those cams never.

00:33:56:08 - 00:34:00:26
Steph
Had an issue with those. I like the the trigger wire setup better than the Z to the offsets.

00:34:00:26 - 00:34:02:06
Steph
And, I don't know.

00:34:02:11 - 00:34:04:09
Steph
I, I place the same cams a second time.

00:34:04:09 - 00:34:05:09
Steph
With an intermediate cam.

00:34:05:09 - 00:34:08:03
Steph
In between. And, went for it and kept.

00:34:08:03 - 00:34:08:17
Steph
Going and.

00:34:08:17 - 00:34:10:23
Steph
Got to the top adult tower.

00:34:10:26 - 00:34:13:08
Steph
I can't remember how long it took me, like four hours.

00:34:13:08 - 00:34:13:13
Steph
Like, it.

00:34:13:13 - 00:34:14:14
Steph
Really wasn't that long.

00:34:14:18 - 00:34:16:29
Steph
It was a pretty, pretty good girl. I was like, okay, I could.

00:34:16:29 - 00:34:18:12
Steph
Could do a Naiad on lead.

00:34:18:12 - 00:34:21:16
Steph
So yeah. So that was like beginning of the trip.

00:34:21:16 - 00:34:22:11
Steph
And then.

00:34:22:11 - 00:34:25:28
Steph
I did take a couple days off because I just had the worst headache after.

00:34:25:28 - 00:34:27:23
Steph
That climb, from hitting my.

00:34:27:23 - 00:34:28:18
Steph
Head.

00:34:28:20 - 00:34:30:20
Steph
Yeah. And I'd pulled the muscle on my.

00:34:30:20 - 00:34:31:18
Steph
Side, but then we climb the.

00:34:31:18 - 00:34:33:16
Steph
Rostrum, and that was fun.

00:34:33:18 - 00:34:35:02
Kyle
it, that's hard.

00:34:35:05 - 00:34:35:27
Steph
It fell hard?

00:34:35:27 - 00:34:36:13
Kyle
It's hard.

00:34:36:17 - 00:34:40:02
Steph
Yeah. I've climbed it twice now. I'd say the second time felt harder.

00:34:40:02 - 00:34:44:22
Steph
But, you know, I'll write that down to having a minor concussion. And then.

00:34:44:22 - 00:34:48:05
Steph
You know, I stayed in the valley for a few more weeks and I really wanted to.

00:34:48:05 - 00:34:49:02
Steph
Climb Astro. Man.

00:34:49:02 - 00:34:50:17
Steph
That was, I got this.

00:34:50:21 - 00:34:53:26
Steph
In my mind that I was going to climb. Astro was going to get up it no matter how.

00:34:53:26 - 00:34:56:12
Steph
I was just gonna experience it. And so.

00:34:56:15 - 00:34:57:10
Steph
Brooke and I.

00:34:57:10 - 00:34:57:27
Steph
The guy.

00:34:57:27 - 00:34:59:23
Steph
Climbed,

00:34:59:26 - 00:35:04:06
Steph
Stacked south with. We went up to do Astro Boy. We were just going to do the top of pitch five.

00:35:04:06 - 00:35:05:06
Steph
And then come down and just.

00:35:05:06 - 00:35:08:16
Steph
Wanted to see what those pitches went like, and they went surprisingly well.

00:35:08:18 - 00:35:11:08
Steph
And then we got there and we had so much time.

00:35:11:08 - 00:35:14:02
Steph
And so I was like, I need the hardening slot.

00:35:14:05 - 00:35:15:23
Steph
Because you can repel from the top of the Harding.

00:35:15:23 - 00:35:17:21
Steph
Slot, you can lower down pretty easily.

00:35:17:21 - 00:35:19:04
Steph
With a single 70.

00:35:19:06 - 00:35:20:17
Steph
And so.

00:35:20:19 - 00:35:22:06
Steph
Yeah, I, struggle.

00:35:22:06 - 00:35:24:18
Steph
My way up the slot. That was quite the beast.

00:35:24:21 - 00:35:25:01
Steph
Not the.

00:35:25:01 - 00:35:27:09
Steph
Greatest wide climber or slot.

00:35:27:09 - 00:35:30:07
Steph
I'm not like slot climbing. To me, it is.

00:35:30:07 - 00:35:30:26
Steph
Very difficult.

00:35:30:26 - 00:35:41:10
Kyle
He had described that that particular pitch because, I mean, it's super infamous. I saw your video of it, but I couldn't really like I couldn't get enough information on like what to expect, like, describe the climbing.

00:35:41:12 - 00:35:44:10
Steph
Yeah. Or the crux itself is getting into the slot.

00:35:44:10 - 00:35:47:00
Steph
It's kind of it.

00:35:47:02 - 00:35:48:07
Steph
You know, it goes from.

00:35:48:07 - 00:35:50:06
Steph
Wider to narrower and.

00:35:50:06 - 00:35:53:14
Steph
It's pretty steep and, and slick walls and you're trying to get in.

00:35:53:14 - 00:35:55:27
Steph
There. Some people never, you know, there's, there's.

00:35:55:27 - 00:35:58:15
Steph
Various chicken wings. There's various techniques.

00:35:58:15 - 00:36:01:18
Steph
For getting in. And then once.

00:36:01:18 - 00:36:04:18
Steph
You're in, you've got to inchworm your way up and it's, there's no.

00:36:04:18 - 00:36:07:01
Steph
Real point in placing gear. I mean, the followers are not going to.

00:36:07:01 - 00:36:17:04
Steph
Appreciate it if you place gear and you're probably not going to fall. You're it's you're in it and it's it's very narrow. And so my struggle was just getting my way through it.

00:36:17:07 - 00:36:25:10
Steph
And I would like toe my, put my toes and then my heels, toes, heels, toes, heels.

00:36:25:12 - 00:36:25:25
Steph
And just.

00:36:25:25 - 00:36:27:05
Steph
Try to, like, inchworm my way.

00:36:27:05 - 00:36:28:08
Steph
Up. Then I.

00:36:28:08 - 00:36:34:29
Steph
Found it was more successful. Try it. Like, as my way up. Like I'd kind of go sideways with my body and then.

00:36:35:01 - 00:36:36:11
Steph
You know, and then switch.

00:36:36:11 - 00:36:37:11
Steph
And go sideways the other way.

00:36:37:11 - 00:36:40:03
Steph
And I would gain some ground that way. And so I kind of.

00:36:40:03 - 00:36:45:13
Steph
Squirmed my way up. It got pretty narrow towards the top. I felt very stuck.

00:36:45:15 - 00:36:45:21
Steph
I'm a.

00:36:45:21 - 00:36:49:10
Steph
Little claustrophobic, but, you know, got through it.

00:36:49:12 - 00:36:52:14
Steph
It was a long lead. I don't like long leads.

00:36:52:14 - 00:37:00:25
Steph
I typically like to move fast. And so the whole time I'm just like this is taking too long. Stay in the line. Even though he had no other ambitions but to rebel. It's just like this.

00:37:00:25 - 00:37:03:22
Steph
This can't happen like this. If I'm doing the whole route.

00:37:03:22 - 00:37:04:23
Steph
I got to figure out how to do

00:37:04:23 - 00:37:06:12
Kyle
this fast.

00:37:06:14 - 00:37:12:24
Kyle
Could you bump a cam above your head if you had the right size? I mean, an eight, an eight? Holy shit. It's big.

00:37:13:02 - 00:37:14:04
Steph
I remember we didn't.

00:37:14:04 - 00:37:34:00
Steph
Have a four and I did come in a couple times. I was like, oh, I've had a four. I could place it kind of back in there and pull. So maybe A42. I don't know if I was just kind of seeing the frustration, but I think you could kind of maybe get a biggish cam back in the corner and pull your way up a little bit, but you don't want to leave it there, the followers.

00:37:34:01 - 00:37:35:25
Steph
Just going to hate you. So yeah, because.

00:37:35:25 - 00:37:36:24
Steph
You want to stay out a bit.

00:37:36:24 - 00:37:43:02
Steph
From the via the gear. Yeah. And then, we did that and repelled and then I.

00:37:43:02 - 00:37:45:06
Steph
Went back at it to actually do the full thing.

00:37:45:06 - 00:37:48:28
Steph
With another partner. And,

00:37:49:01 - 00:37:58:21
Steph
We get like five pitches up there out below the slot and my partner's like, so do you want to, do you want to just, like, repelling and have a nice dinner like, you know, like this looks kind of heinous.

00:37:58:21 - 00:38:02:13
Steph
And I'm like, oh boy, this isn't happening.

00:38:02:16 - 00:38:04:17
Kyle
Is there's just a kind way to suggest bailing.

00:38:04:20 - 00:38:16:04
Steph
Yeah, it was very kind way. It's like pizza. That kid. And I was like, oh, you know, that sounds nice, but I kind of want to do this route like it was is not even noon yet, which, you know, it's still a fair bit to go, but it's it's.

00:38:16:04 - 00:38:17:05
Steph
Summer and like.

00:38:17:05 - 00:38:19:15
Steph
Late summer, we had plenty of daylight to do it.

00:38:19:18 - 00:38:21:09
Steph
And when went to.

00:38:21:09 - 00:38:24:07
Steph
Us, one thing that did slow us down a bit is there was a party ahead of us.

00:38:24:07 - 00:38:28:24
Steph
In the slot. But, this guy named Rory, he.

00:38:28:24 - 00:38:29:07
Steph
He led the.

00:38:29:07 - 00:38:30:17
Steph
Slot and he let it.

00:38:30:20 - 00:38:37:19
Steph
Excellent lead of the slot. And then he's like, hey, we can, because of all the time we took, we can pull your rope up and you can just pop up the slot.

00:38:37:21 - 00:38:38:27
Steph
I was like, oh, sweet.

00:38:39:04 - 00:38:40:13
Steph
So.

00:38:40:15 - 00:38:40:23
Steph
We.

00:38:40:23 - 00:38:43:07
Steph
Took a top up on the slot, we get to the top of the slot.

00:38:43:07 - 00:38:48:27
Steph
And, I guess my partner still not into it. And the slots kind of demoralizing.

00:38:49:00 - 00:38:52:03
Steph
And I do, I do get him to blame.

00:38:52:03 - 00:38:52:20
Steph
Me on the next.

00:38:52:20 - 00:39:04:12
Steph
Pitch. And so I climb pitch seven, because on the top there's a bolt anchor, or there was at least a there was something that seemed like there would be something I could repel off of at the top of the pitch. There wasn't.

00:39:04:20 - 00:39:05:22
Steph
There was one bolt.

00:39:05:25 - 00:39:08:08
Steph
But there's maybe two. I probably should read.

00:39:08:08 - 00:39:10:13
Steph
Mountain Project comments a bit more on that one, but.

00:39:10:13 - 00:39:15:21
Steph
There was one bolt, and so I just kind of lowered up one bolt and just hoped it held it did.

00:39:15:23 - 00:39:16:03
Steph
And then.

00:39:16:03 - 00:39:17:25
Steph
We went back to the down the ground.

00:39:17:27 - 00:39:19:00
Steph
And,

00:39:19:02 - 00:39:20:04
Steph
I thought that was going to be the.

00:39:20:04 - 00:39:20:28
Steph
End. But then.

00:39:21:01 - 00:39:23:08
Steph
My friend from Colorado arrived in the Valley.

00:39:23:08 - 00:39:23:25
Steph
And.

00:39:23:25 - 00:39:24:18
Steph
He had had a similar.

00:39:24:18 - 00:39:26:04
Steph
Experience on Astro man, where he'd.

00:39:26:04 - 00:39:26:13
Steph
Tried.

00:39:26:13 - 00:39:27:14
Steph
Twice and got.

00:39:27:14 - 00:39:28:06
Steph
To.

00:39:28:09 - 00:39:28:28
Steph
You know.

00:39:29:00 - 00:39:31:02
Steph
Gotten to the top of the slot or just below.

00:39:31:02 - 00:39:35:29
Steph
It and, and bailed. And so, like, we're going to do it and,

00:39:36:01 - 00:39:37:06
Steph
We, we went for it.

00:39:37:06 - 00:39:38:05
Steph
And.

00:39:38:08 - 00:39:43:08
Steph
We did. It was great. We topped out like 2 p.m. like it was it was just it was like the perfect ascent.

00:39:43:08 - 00:39:48:27
Steph
Of of Astro man. Everything went well. We cruised up that, my carabiner had left.

00:39:48:27 - 00:39:49:28
Steph
The week before. I was still.

00:39:49:28 - 00:39:50:08
Steph
On that.

00:39:50:09 - 00:39:53:09
Steph
That bolt. So I guess no one had done it since.

00:39:53:11 - 00:39:53:20
Steph
Yeah.

00:39:53:26 - 00:39:55:25
Kyle
That's cool. Congrats. That's a big one.

00:39:56:01 - 00:40:00:05
Steph
Thank you than that because it took so many times to do it was

00:40:00:08 - 00:40:11:11
Kyle
No one more meaningful? Yeah. How many pitches is it again? So ten. Ten. Okay. It's much harder than, than, rostrum.

00:40:11:13 - 00:40:15:24
Steph
I'd say if you subtract the holding slot, I don't really.

00:40:15:24 - 00:40:17:24
Steph
Find it hard in the rostrum.

00:40:17:26 - 00:40:19:12
Steph
But once you put her in the slot in there.

00:40:19:13 - 00:40:21:26
Steph
Yeah, yeah. And the energy.

00:40:21:26 - 00:40:23:24
Steph
It takes and the demoralizing factor that.

00:40:23:24 - 00:40:25:00
Steph
Although my partner.

00:40:25:00 - 00:40:26:15
Steph
Just. He got up.

00:40:26:15 - 00:40:27:22
Steph
The thing in like ten minutes.

00:40:27:22 - 00:40:30:25
Steph
So for him it's easy. Yes. So there's a way.

00:40:30:25 - 00:40:31:16
Steph
I just don't know

00:40:31:20 - 00:40:35:08
Kyle
Yeah. Have you done Voyager? Yeah. That one's really good, too.

00:40:35:11 - 00:40:36:24
Steph
fun. So is, the other.

00:40:36:24 - 00:40:37:16
Steph
One,

00:40:37:19 - 00:40:45:05
Kyle
Oh, the one off to the left. Off to the left. Yeah.

00:40:45:07 - 00:40:46:09
Kyle
I don't remember,

00:40:46:11 - 00:40:47:27
Steph
Yeah, that was really good. So I was Bird of.

00:40:47:27 - 00:40:49:13
Steph
Prey there on this.

00:40:49:16 - 00:40:51:19
Steph
Yeah, I love you. But just because the rats.

00:40:51:19 - 00:40:55:22
Steph
Are kind of modern, they're they've got repel rats.

00:40:55:25 - 00:40:57:21
Kyle
yeah I'll be center of the universe.

00:40:57:21 - 00:40:59:00
Steph
Center of the universe. That's it. Yeah.

00:40:59:05 - 00:41:01:08
Kyle
I'll be on the nose in May.

00:41:01:10 - 00:41:01:25
Steph
Oh, nice.

00:41:01:25 - 00:41:05:24
Kyle
Yeah. May like the right in the middle of May.

00:41:05:28 - 00:41:06:11
Steph
Okay,

00:41:06:14 - 00:41:08:14
Kyle
Yeah. Okay. Sick. Cool.

00:41:08:20 - 00:41:09:29
Steph
might be doing Nyad.

00:41:10:02 - 00:41:14:02
Kyle
Oh wow. No way. We're doing it in three days. Yeah.

00:41:14:05 - 00:41:14:29
Kyle
Yeah. How do you.

00:41:15:01 - 00:41:26:06
Kyle
Know my buddy has. He's done it in three days, and so it's our time to do it as a team. So I get familiar with the route. And then we're gonna come back in October and try to do Nyad.

00:41:26:12 - 00:41:26:19
Steph
Yeah.

00:41:26:20 - 00:41:28:23
Steph
Nice. That's the way to do it. That's what I do as well.

00:41:28:23 - 00:41:31:05
Steph
And, Yeah, I certainly want the familiarity.

00:41:31:07 - 00:41:33:18
Kyle
So you'll be pushing for your first night on

00:41:33:21 - 00:41:34:11
Steph
it'll be second.

00:41:34:11 - 00:41:35:26
Kyle
Second. Oh, wow. Cool.

00:41:35:29 - 00:41:40:12
Steph
yeah I just want a better time. You know, y'all and my partner's already done it too. And he. He wants a better time.

00:41:40:19 - 00:41:40:25
Steph
Yeah.

00:41:40:25 - 00:41:41:07
Kyle
badass.

00:41:41:12 - 00:41:45:04
Steph
That's that's it. Just every time. Well I think the need is something that you can.

00:41:45:04 - 00:41:51:07
Steph
Really drastically improve your time on over the course of many attempts. But yeah, that.

00:41:51:07 - 00:41:54:29
Steph
That's part of the plan. And a few other free routes. We were thinking of.

00:41:54:29 - 00:41:56:14
Steph
Doing,

00:41:56:17 - 00:42:04:28
Steph
Free Rider or Salazar. I would just be, you know, doing those in aid mode, but my partner was kind of wanting to try a free as much as free riders you could.

00:42:04:28 - 00:42:05:23
Steph
And then.

00:42:05:26 - 00:42:10:01
Steph
I don't know, I think we just got overwhelmed by by all the details.

00:42:10:01 - 00:42:14:26
Steph
And and having it a poor ledge. Neither one of us owns a porta ledge. And, we.

00:42:14:26 - 00:42:17:11
Steph
Decided just to keep it as a free.

00:42:17:13 - 00:42:19:09
Steph
You know, free week of climbing.

00:42:19:12 - 00:42:22:03
Kyle
Cool. You know, what day you're going to be doing? Had.

00:42:22:05 - 00:42:27:08
Steph
Know, but we're going to be there from, like the, 10th to the 18th.

00:42:27:11 - 00:42:41:20
Kyle
Okay, I hope I hope you pass me, I hope you pass us. It's I know the week. I don't know the specific day yet. I just I've, we've blocked off the whole week. So I'll probably be rolling in Sunday and we're going to try to do it during the week.

00:42:41:23 - 00:42:53:19
Kyle
That's literally the same week. Yeah. Okay. That would be cool. That would be cool. Yeah. It's probably going to be like the 12, 13, 14, something like that in the middle of the week because we're gonna try to stay away from whatever crowds there might be.

00:42:53:22 - 00:42:54:28
Kyle
Yeah. Cool. Awesome.

00:42:55:06 - 00:42:55:13
Steph
Yeah.

00:42:55:14 - 00:42:58:24
Steph
And we might do the West Festival cap, too, because I really I've always wanted to do a.

00:42:58:24 - 00:43:01:08
Steph
A free route on El Cap other than these

00:43:01:10 - 00:43:02:08
Kyle
quite cool.

00:43:02:11 - 00:43:24:06
Kyle
What about, I guess let's talk about Zion Zion's, like, after I do all the stuff out here in Red Rock. Or at least a large portion of what I'm able to do, Zion is going to be like the next big destination. You were climbing some of, like, the all the routes I have on my take list.

00:43:24:08 - 00:43:30:11
Kyle
What was your experience with that place? Do you like the climbing there? Kind of the same thing with Yosemite was.

00:43:30:14 - 00:43:33:20
Steph
really my first real trip to Zion. So I had had.

00:43:33:20 - 00:43:36:03
Steph
Zion in my.

00:43:36:05 - 00:43:37:17
Steph
Eyesight for years.

00:43:37:17 - 00:43:41:07
Steph
And never climb there. The first road I climb there was moonlight with,

00:43:41:11 - 00:43:43:11
Kyle
The first route in Zion. And you're like, well, well.

00:43:43:12 - 00:43:43:19
Kyle
I

00:43:43:25 - 00:43:45:14
Steph
kind of. I was just pestering.

00:43:45:14 - 00:43:47:01
Steph
My partner,

00:43:47:04 - 00:43:53:00
Steph
To climb moonlight, and he was using. He was. He wanted sport climb. So I was like, if I sport climb with.

00:43:53:00 - 00:43:57:09
Steph
You in red rock. And wherever we were, at Lime Kiln, you know, we were.

00:43:57:09 - 00:44:02:06
Steph
In this area. I was like, we're climbing or we're just going to get up it because he'd done it before. He'd freed it.

00:44:02:06 - 00:44:04:03
Steph
And,

00:44:04:05 - 00:44:09:15
Steph
So we did it. Yeah, we swung lasers. You know, I wouldn't call my ascent a free isn't the first.

00:44:09:15 - 00:44:12:10
Steph
Time or even the second time, but, yeah,

00:44:12:13 - 00:44:13:11
Kyle
Is it approachable?

00:44:13:18 - 00:44:13:27
Steph
it's.

00:44:13:27 - 00:44:16:19
Steph
Very approachable because you could totally do the five, ten.

00:44:16:25 - 00:44:17:21
Steph
One.

00:44:17:24 - 00:44:18:13
Kyle
Oh, okay.

00:44:18:14 - 00:44:23:27
Steph
So in that sense, it's very approachable. And there's a lot of it's not hard climbing. So if you do a five, ten.

00:44:23:27 - 00:44:27:05
Steph
C when you're eating a lot, but yeah.

00:44:27:07 - 00:44:28:25
Steph
I just love those enduro

00:44:28:28 - 00:44:35:20
Kyle
Oh, yeah. I heard that since people, so many people ate it, the crack isn't really split or more. And so you get like, constrictions with your fingers.

00:44:35:20 - 00:44:36:26
Steph
Yeah you do. Yeah.

00:44:36:26 - 00:44:43:13
Steph
Yeah. It's it's great. It's endurance. Ally backing. Really. Yes. It's great. Yeah. That was my first. Yeah. And then we climbed since that time

00:44:43:13 - 00:44:44:16
Kyle
That one looks so good.

00:44:44:16 - 00:44:44:21
Kyle
Which

00:44:44:24 - 00:44:46:23
Steph
is one of my favorite ruts there.

00:44:46:23 - 00:44:47:07
Steph
And Shine.

00:44:47:07 - 00:44:49:27
Steph
Light is great which I ended up climbing this last.

00:44:49:27 - 00:44:53:07
Steph
Year when I went on my real Zion climbing binge. I guess.

00:44:53:09 - 00:44:57:09
Steph
So that was so last fall is really the first time I gave it a real go.

00:44:57:09 - 00:45:00:05
Steph
And the climb tattling, which, it's.

00:45:00:05 - 00:45:05:06
Steph
Like a 15 pitch. You are very good. Very good route. You can repel.

00:45:05:06 - 00:45:08:29
Steph
It, I think with this, you know, I think double ropes. But a lot of them are.

00:45:08:29 - 00:45:09:28
Steph
Single, so it's set up for.

00:45:09:28 - 00:45:17:16
Steph
Rappelling, which is great. Climbed Monkey Finger, which is nice adventure. Climbed.

00:45:17:16 - 00:45:18:22
Steph
Touch Stone wall, which is a.

00:45:18:22 - 00:45:20:08
Steph
Super fun.

00:45:20:10 - 00:45:23:22
Steph
It starts with three aid pitches and then it's just a bunch of five, 8 to.

00:45:23:22 - 00:45:30:10
Steph
5, ten. Fun climbing to a nice summit. What else do we climb? Climb? Moonlight again was.

00:45:30:10 - 00:45:32:05
Steph
A different partner.

00:45:32:07 - 00:45:32:27
Steph
And that's.

00:45:32:27 - 00:45:33:24
Steph
The kind of route I climb.

00:45:33:24 - 00:45:36:02
Steph
Again. Again. I think it would take me a while before.

00:45:36:02 - 00:45:36:15
Steph
I ended.

00:45:36:15 - 00:45:37:10
Steph
Up freeing every.

00:45:37:10 - 00:45:38:21
Steph
Single bit of it. But

00:45:38:24 - 00:45:40:05
Steph
second time was better in the first for me.

00:45:40:09 - 00:45:45:14
Kyle
What's the, barrier for you? Is it fitness? Is it technique?

00:45:45:16 - 00:45:49:19
Steph
Probably a mixture of all of that and familiarity.

00:45:49:21 - 00:45:53:25
Steph
I'm not sure if I could ever get the rock or block move. So my sister's actually freed.

00:45:53:25 - 00:45:54:14
Steph
Moonlight.

00:45:54:14 - 00:45:56:17
Steph
And it took her several.

00:45:56:19 - 00:45:57:16
Steph
Several, you know.

00:45:57:16 - 00:45:57:28
Steph
Top.

00:45:57:28 - 00:45:59:24
Steph
Down, you know, working on pitches.

00:45:59:24 - 00:46:08:19
Steph
To do. And she never got the rock or block move. And Aster was like, how do you do it? Then she's like, I sit in a pack. So I don't know. I mean, you can stand on a pack and they do that.

00:46:08:22 - 00:46:09:18
Steph
But it's.

00:46:09:18 - 00:46:12:14
Steph
If you if you can't reach it, you can't reach it. If you can't jump that.

00:46:12:14 - 00:46:15:09
Steph
High, then what can you do? So,

00:46:15:12 - 00:46:16:12
Steph
Yeah. So my partner did.

00:46:16:12 - 00:46:16:27
Steph
Dino and.

00:46:16:27 - 00:46:19:02
Steph
Latched it, and, so that's the way to get up.

00:46:19:02 - 00:46:21:12
Steph
There. And then you still got some hard moves to get.

00:46:21:14 - 00:46:23:13
Steph
Above that dino before.

00:46:23:18 - 00:46:26:15
Steph
You feel secure again. Yeah.

00:46:26:17 - 00:46:37:00
Steph
So, yeah, I think for me, it's it's, familiarity with the moves, and I'd have to work some of the pitches, the 0.5 size Camelot pitch.

00:46:37:02 - 00:46:38:07
Steph
I'd have to figure out.

00:46:38:07 - 00:46:40:14
Steph
My technique a bit better on that one, too.

00:46:40:17 - 00:46:42:07
Kyle
It's pretty loose ring locks for you.

00:46:42:09 - 00:46:45:08
Kyle
I think I need to take,

00:46:45:11 - 00:46:49:03
Kyle
Where are you taping that? Like, fingers themselves. The thumb two or.

00:46:49:10 - 00:46:52:28
Steph
for that pitch, but I think, I think just really heavily.

00:46:52:28 - 00:46:55:10
Steph
Taping my fingers to make them a little bigger might.

00:46:55:10 - 00:46:55:26
Steph
Help because.

00:46:55:26 - 00:46:58:07
Steph
I'm just not getting anything that that sticks.

00:46:58:07 - 00:47:00:09
Steph
So maybe partially.

00:47:00:09 - 00:47:06:12
Steph
The thumb and a couple of fingers and just trying to get a ring lock in there. Yeah. And maybe.

00:47:06:14 - 00:47:10:19
Steph
Bringing different shoes in when I had maybe a softer shoe. That kind of goes into that crack a little

00:47:10:24 - 00:47:12:07
Kyle
less than a toe height.

00:47:12:09 - 00:47:13:02
Steph
Yeah.

00:47:13:04 - 00:47:13:17
Steph
Yeah.

00:47:13:17 - 00:47:18:03
Steph
So maybe some, Naiad moccasins or something. Yeah. So.

00:47:18:05 - 00:47:21:26
Steph
Yeah, everything. There's a lot of tricks I could still try.

00:47:21:29 - 00:47:23:24
Kyle
Is how busy of a route is it?

00:47:23:26 - 00:47:25:10
Steph
I we were the only party on both times.

00:47:25:18 - 00:47:30:15
Steph
Yeah. It's not as busy as I thought it would be. Maybe it's kind of gotten out of vogue or I don't know, or we got lucky.

00:47:30:19 - 00:47:38:02
Kyle
Yeah, yeah, that's really cool. You're such a crusher. Oh. That's awesome. Like, these root.

00:47:38:05 - 00:47:38:17
Steph
up things.

00:47:38:17 - 00:47:58:19
Kyle
Well, I mean, it's like. I mean, there's even a level of thinking that you can do it in the first place. You know, obviously there's experience there and like, you've worked up to it, but still, I think, I don't know, it's very easy to just kind of like live in these like, self-doubts or just like, don't think things are possible or you hear like Moonlight Buttress or the nose and you're just like, there's no way that's for me, you know?

00:47:58:19 - 00:48:05:13
Kyle
But like, I love talking to people like yourself and other climbers that are just normal people and they're just like, oh, it crushing. It's just so cool.

00:48:05:14 - 00:48:05:23
Kyle
Oh, I

00:48:05:25 - 00:48:08:20
Steph
mean, for years there was it was there's no way that's for me.

00:48:08:23 - 00:48:10:10
Steph
Moonlight was one of them.

00:48:10:10 - 00:48:16:10
Steph
Until the last couple of years. I was like, you know, I think I could give it a go, you know, drop the idea of.

00:48:16:12 - 00:48:18:12
Steph
Freeing it on kind of

00:48:18:14 - 00:48:24:15
Kyle
Isn't that such a key? Yeah. It's like, yeah, don't not pick an objective because you don't think you can climb it clean.

00:48:24:22 - 00:48:31:23
Steph
Yeah, that's that's definitely been my mode for these harder climbs. And it's, it's been a good mode because you know it's such a good route in.

00:48:31:23 - 00:48:32:14
Steph
And maybe you.

00:48:32:14 - 00:48:33:13
Steph
Give me a couple tents and you get.

00:48:33:13 - 00:48:35:24
Steph
It free. You know, it's kind of more of a project level for

00:48:35:24 - 00:48:36:10
Kyle
me.

00:48:36:13 - 00:48:38:15
Kyle
Are you a taker or a follower.

00:48:38:17 - 00:48:40:15
Steph
I'll take. Yeah.

00:48:40:17 - 00:48:42:04
Steph
Yeah, I just was in Spain.

00:48:42:04 - 00:48:44:08
Steph
Sport climbing for two months and.

00:48:44:10 - 00:48:48:25
Steph
I don't think I took, I took one unexpected fall.

00:48:48:27 - 00:48:54:25
Steph
And all the other times I had down climb or take and it's like if I had enough energy to down climb these hard moves, I probably have enough energy to keep.

00:48:54:25 - 00:48:57:28
Steph
Going and clip the next bolt. But

00:48:58:01 - 00:49:00:00
Kyle
I'm the same way. I'm a taker.

00:49:00:03 - 00:49:04:23
Kyle
And, I just find it so much safer in the long run

00:49:04:26 - 00:49:17:03
Kyle
because, like, you know. Sure. Falling safe. Of course. Especially, you know, but, I mean, when you fall, it's like you're exposed to chaos, and it's like anything can happen. You maybe didn't read the gear, right? Whatever or whatever.

00:49:17:03 - 00:49:48:03
Kyle
I repeat myself a lot on this podcast, on this, on this note. But for me, like, just if you can down climb or you can take because you have this connection to the rock and you know whether or not you're going to be on or not. And you can like, make a pretty good discernment of like whether I can make these moves and I would much rather rest, take and then like just execute the sequence fresh and like smooth and delicate and like technical rather than just like trying to scream and like get something and maybe pop and fall weird like it's just, not the experience I'm going for.

00:49:48:05 - 00:49:49:05
Kyle
Yeah. Let's go.

00:49:49:11 - 00:49:51:26
Steph
I like I mean, that's a good way to put it. Yeah.

00:49:51:29 - 00:49:57:02
Kyle
And you've you I think maybe it's because we're both post injury people.

00:49:57:05 - 00:50:14:06
Kyle
I think, I talked to my buddy Phil recently about, like, the concept of survivorship bias, and we don't have that. How has that how have the several injuries that you've had, linked in to your climbing in the present day? Yeah.

00:50:14:08 - 00:50:16:16
Steph
I feel like I've had a lot of injuries, but also, I think.

00:50:16:16 - 00:50:20:12
Steph
For the amount I've gotten out in the I've done probably not, you know, like,

00:50:20:16 - 00:50:21:26
Kyle
still there.

00:50:21:29 - 00:50:22:13
Kyle
traumatic.

00:50:22:13 - 00:50:23:02
Kyle
Injuries,

00:50:23:02 - 00:50:27:19
Steph
those have been the, the, those have been rather vague. So the first one was really the.

00:50:27:19 - 00:50:29:25
Steph
Main one that kind of, affected.

00:50:29:25 - 00:50:31:03
Steph
Probably.

00:50:31:05 - 00:50:33:04
Steph
Everything. You know, and.

00:50:33:04 - 00:50:36:13
Steph
Still this day, was when I had attempted.

00:50:36:14 - 00:50:41:08
Steph
Fracture during rockfall on Vesper Peak in 2010.

00:50:41:10 - 00:50:43:14
Steph
I was taking my sister on her first.

00:50:43:17 - 00:50:45:25
Steph
Alpine climb, actually,

00:50:45:28 - 00:50:48:15
Steph
Which is so ironic because she ended up becoming such a great.

00:50:48:15 - 00:50:51:09
Steph
Alpinist and and great climber. And that.

00:50:51:09 - 00:50:54:11
Steph
That I think that whole experience kind of propelled her.

00:50:54:11 - 00:50:56:13
Steph
Into self-confidence and stuff.

00:50:56:16 - 00:51:05:17
Steph
But anyway, I, I had a rockfall. I was on lead and I didn't fall far, but I kind of knew before I even hit the rock that something was drastically.

00:51:05:17 - 00:51:06:28
Steph
Wrong with my left foot.

00:51:07:01 - 00:51:16:17
Steph
And so, you know, I just I think that the, the rockfall itself had something to do with how bad the injury was. But my, my foot was basically torn off. It was hanging.

00:51:16:18 - 00:51:18:08
Steph
There by not much, you know,

00:51:18:11 - 00:51:20:24
Steph
Arteries, blood.

00:51:20:26 - 00:51:23:19
Steph
Arteries are severed, nerves were severed, blood was everywhere.

00:51:23:21 - 00:51:24:20
Steph
Bones are sticking out.

00:51:24:20 - 00:51:26:19
Steph
It's kind of gross.

00:51:26:22 - 00:51:27:19
Steph
Jenny.

00:51:27:23 - 00:51:35:00
Steph
My sister, was kind of around the corner a bit, so she was not hit by the rock, which is great. She also didn't really see the foot. And so.

00:51:35:00 - 00:51:36:18
Steph
I got her a little lower me down to the.

00:51:36:18 - 00:51:37:00
Steph
Ledge we.

00:51:37:00 - 00:51:40:26
Steph
Were on and, you know, she never really saw it. I.

00:51:40:26 - 00:51:48:13
Steph
Kind of tried to put it back in place and I was like, okay, let's, let's, let's wrap this in a shirt. We had crampons, and so we, we took the straps off the.

00:51:48:13 - 00:51:50:13
Steph
Crampons and tied that around it.

00:51:50:13 - 00:51:53:00
Steph
We had an ice ax. We put that on there to splint.

00:51:53:00 - 00:51:55:29
Steph
It up and hold it in place.

00:51:56:01 - 00:52:13:02
Steph
We did do a tourniquet. We were like, well, let's see, there's an artery in the thigh we know about, so let's just take a sling and a burner and tighten it around the, the thigh and, cut off the blood flow. And that seemed to work, you know, good enough, at least. And, elevated it in the bush.

00:52:13:02 - 00:52:14:19
Steph
And.

00:52:14:22 - 00:52:20:12
Steph
Then was like, well, we have to get help. And we had my cell phone with me, which was a flip phone. It was 2010.

00:52:20:12 - 00:52:25:21
Steph
But I, I don't I think I phoned her out, but I didn't have one. I had a flip phone.

00:52:25:23 - 00:52:27:12
Steph
Had, Verizon.

00:52:27:12 - 00:52:28:15
Steph
And I.

00:52:28:15 - 00:52:35:11
Steph
Knew from a previous experience the previous summer that, Verizon, you could get a signal from a lot of the summits.

00:52:35:14 - 00:52:37:03
Steph
So,

00:52:37:05 - 00:52:48:22
Steph
Jenny ended up taking the rope in the gear and, you know, rappelling several times back down to the glacier, scrambled up to the ridge, went up the descent route all over the summit and got a phone call out.

00:52:48:24 - 00:52:52:10
Steph
Somehow I think she got directly in touch with the the helicopter rescue.

00:52:52:10 - 00:52:53:24
Steph
Team, and,

00:52:53:26 - 00:52:55:10
Steph
Told them that we needed a short.

00:52:55:10 - 00:52:57:13
Steph
Haul and,

00:52:57:15 - 00:53:01:20
Steph
I think they were a bit taken aback, but, yeah, someone asking for a short haul, like.

00:53:01:22 - 00:53:02:15
Steph
That's not really a.

00:53:02:15 - 00:53:18:25
Steph
Common thing to know about, but I had been part of a short haul rescue the previous summer, so I, you know, Jenny knew about it and I told her about I was like, we need a short haul, Jenny. We need to short haul. And, that's she. Tell them. And that's what they did, too. So, the helicopter rescue team was just mobilizing.

00:53:18:27 - 00:53:19:07
Steph
For.

00:53:19:08 - 00:53:20:12
Steph
Body recovery, which was.

00:53:20:12 - 00:53:21:02
Steph
Unrelated.

00:53:21:02 - 00:53:32:08
Steph
And but that was really fortunate because they were all there on the pad, and they the helicopter was already ready to go, and they just kind of detoured to, to me. And they flew over. They saw me.

00:53:32:10 - 00:53:33:19
Steph
They they landed.

00:53:33:19 - 00:53:36:02
Steph
And at that point, I didn't know they'd seen me.

00:53:36:02 - 00:53:39:24
Steph
And I was like, oh, no, they didn't see me. They flew away or no, but they were just landing.

00:53:39:25 - 00:53:41:07
Steph
To.

00:53:41:09 - 00:53:45:01
Steph
Yeah, gear up the the guy who was going to come down and put me in a.

00:53:45:01 - 00:53:48:26
Steph
Screamer suit. So next thing I know, they're they're back. And this guy's.

00:53:48:26 - 00:53:52:20
Steph
Like on a on a long line flying,

00:53:52:22 - 00:54:03:09
Steph
Below the helicopter. And they swing him in and he unclip and, like, stays with me and puts me in a screamer suit. And then, they swing back with the big hook.

00:54:03:09 - 00:54:04:10
Steph
And,

00:54:04:12 - 00:54:09:02
Steph
He exit into both of us, and we go flying away. And so it was kind of a wild ride.

00:54:09:04 - 00:54:12:29
Steph
And, you know, get down and, get all.

00:54:13:07 - 00:54:17:13
Steph
You know, stabilized. And then they took off again to the hospital.

00:54:17:13 - 00:54:24:09
Steph
And I at some point during that, I just kind of drifted off. And I didn't wake up till the next morning. Yeah. So I don't really.

00:54:24:09 - 00:54:27:19
Steph
Know all the stuff that went on. But I do know that they had the saw.

00:54:27:19 - 00:54:28:10
Steph
Out and they were going to.

00:54:28:10 - 00:54:29:27
Steph
Amputate.

00:54:29:29 - 00:54:30:04
Steph
And.

00:54:30:04 - 00:54:45:17
Steph
It was, it was looking pretty likely I wouldn't have the foot. But then they, there's a vascular surgeon that they called in and he was like, well, I'll give it a go. She's young and healthy and it might work. And so he reconstructed the arteries in my leg overnight. It took him several hours.

00:54:45:17 - 00:54:48:03
Steph
And, it worked. Yeah.

00:54:48:03 - 00:54:58:00
Steph
So I woke up with a leg or a foot. But it didn't work. So because the nerves are severed. So it's like, okay, well, I have a foot, but it might never respond anymore.

00:54:58:00 - 00:55:01:09
Steph
Like, it might never move up. And down. I couldn't wiggle my toes.

00:55:01:11 - 00:55:03:26
Steph
And I was like that for several weeks.

00:55:03:29 - 00:55:05:01
Steph
And then, you know, one.

00:55:05:01 - 00:55:07:11
Steph
Day I was able to wiggle toe a little bit and.

00:55:07:13 - 00:55:08:14
Steph
You know, the.

00:55:08:16 - 00:55:09:04
Steph
Sky broke.

00:55:09:04 - 00:55:10:25
Steph
Open again and there was sunshine.

00:55:10:25 - 00:55:13:23
Steph
And yeah, this is like, I'm going to I'm going to go back and.

00:55:13:23 - 00:55:25:19
Kyle
Yeah. Wow. Yeah. As a, as a, as a fellow lower extremity injury. Nowhere near the severity of that. But I feel for the pain and the recovery process. It's been 15 years though.

00:55:25:26 - 00:55:26:06
Steph
Yeah.

00:55:26:10 - 00:55:33:08
Kyle
Does it still affect your climbing? Whether it's mental or physical?

00:55:33:11 - 00:55:41:19
Steph
I think it affects me both physically and mentally. So another piece of that story is it wasn't healing. And so I ended up with immersive infection.

00:55:41:22 - 00:55:49:02
Steph
So they had to take out all the hardware. And at that point it shifted. And so they were like, I will re break once.

00:55:49:02 - 00:55:49:24
Steph
You know, once.

00:55:49:24 - 00:55:59:25
Steph
You heal up, will we break? And I never did get the re break done. So there's a part of that lay that's a little bit gimpy. It's, it's a little bit off. I do.

00:55:59:26 - 00:56:01:16
Steph
Trip and she's.

00:56:01:19 - 00:56:09:06
Steph
You know why I tripped on the gel the other day? Probably. I don't know, is that, but, there's there's some lack of knowledge of where that foot actually is.

00:56:09:06 - 00:56:10:07
Steph
Within, like, an inch.

00:56:10:14 - 00:56:21:29
Steph
And so that does affect me climbing, especially when I think about it, when I'm on a face and like, it's a, it's a really thin left foot, like a little ledge or like a little edge or something, or a slab, you move.

00:56:21:29 - 00:56:24:22
Steph
I'm like, I can't feel that right. I don't know is my foot on it.

00:56:24:22 - 00:56:29:09
Steph
And I think that does mess with me sometimes on harder climbing.

00:56:29:11 - 00:56:30:13
Steph
Crack climbing is a.

00:56:30:13 - 00:56:32:14
Steph
Lot easier for me because it's like, well, it's jammed in.

00:56:32:14 - 00:56:35:10
Steph
The crack. All right, no big deal.

00:56:35:12 - 00:56:44:14
Steph
And I think along with the physical, which is, is is minor, you know, there's that's I've learned to deal with that pretty well. So it's kind of background.

00:56:44:16 - 00:56:47:04
Steph
Mentally. Yeah. Just the side of that.

00:56:47:04 - 00:56:48:18
Steph
Fall and it.

00:56:48:21 - 00:56:50:16
Steph
I don't think I've ever quite gotten over it.

00:56:50:19 - 00:56:52:17
Steph
That such a small fall.

00:56:52:17 - 00:56:53:16
Steph
Could result in such.

00:56:53:16 - 00:56:54:28
Steph
A bad injury.

00:56:55:01 - 00:56:56:16
Steph
And I just, I don't want to fall.

00:56:56:16 - 00:56:58:08
Steph
And so that kind of holds me back of it.

00:56:58:08 - 00:57:00:20
Steph
Sometimes this fear.

00:57:00:22 - 00:57:01:13
Steph
Yeah.

00:57:01:15 - 00:57:12:23
Kyle
Yeah. You, you have a quote that you wrote me said some days I feel like I can lead anything. Others, there's more fear. I've gotten to the point where well protected climbing is fine to lead, but run outs are always an issue.

00:57:12:25 - 00:57:16:12
Steph
And that's that's that's sums it up. Yeah.

00:57:16:14 - 00:57:24:21
Kyle
Did you ever have, like, how was your lead head before the accident? Like, were you able to just, like, go on, big run outs? Like, that wasn't an issue at all?

00:57:24:24 - 00:57:35:09
Steph
No, I would say, well, I guess I guess so, but I was only climbing up to like five, 8 or 9 like so before the accident. I was mainly an alpinist. I, I did a lot of North Cascades.

00:57:35:09 - 00:57:36:09
Steph
Mountaineering and.

00:57:36:15 - 00:57:47:17
Steph
The hardest stuff I would climb back, there would be like five, eight. So I was I was, you know, comfortable with run outs on five eight and I still am. So yeah, five eight is a great where I typically.

00:57:47:19 - 00:57:49:29
Steph
I don't really mind a run out. It's when it.

00:57:49:29 - 00:57:50:13
Steph
Gets a little.

00:57:50:13 - 00:57:53:07
Steph
Harder where run outs become an issue.

00:57:53:09 - 00:58:02:26
Steph
So it's hard to say, but I, I never liked falling. Know I would climb harder routes on occasion. I'd say index when I was before my injury, and I didn't like falling, and I didn't really like.

00:58:02:26 - 00:58:06:03
Steph
Leaving, above gear and,

00:58:06:05 - 00:58:19:18
Steph
All that. So it just kind of gave me more of a reason to not like it, I think, and and less of a reason to, to try to overcome it. Yeah. I just it was like, oh, I got this excuse now of why, why I'm.

00:58:19:18 - 00:58:21:02
Steph
Struggling with it. And.

00:58:21:04 - 00:58:22:19
Steph
You know, maybe I should have thought that a bit.

00:58:22:19 - 00:58:27:19
Steph
More at the beginning. But now that it's been so long, I just gotta, gotta work with it.

00:58:27:22 - 00:58:29:06
Steph
But like I said, like.

00:58:29:08 - 00:58:32:09
Steph
Well protected climbing I'm good with. And that's.

00:58:32:11 - 00:58:33:20
Kyle
I can just fine. Well protected.

00:58:33:20 - 00:59:03:21
Kyle
Stuff. Yeah. I mean, you're Moonlight Buttress. No need. Like all these routes we just talked about Yosemite. Like, it's just. It's such a good reminder. I think for people, it's like, you can have this safety conscious mentality and still go after all of these iconic climbs. I definitely think there's a little bit of a push in that gets maybe it's dying a little bit, but definitely a little bit more of a push where it's like you equivocate, like hard, bold climbing to just like as a, as a mandatory part of like, hard climbing.

00:59:03:27 - 00:59:05:09
Kyle
It's like it doesn't have to be that way.

00:59:05:15 - 00:59:05:16
Kyle
You

00:59:05:19 - 00:59:10:08
Steph
No. Like the rostrum, the nose, the astro man. Moonlight.

00:59:10:08 - 00:59:11:18
Steph
Those are all just gear.

00:59:11:18 - 00:59:13:21
Steph
Whatever you want them. So.

00:59:13:23 - 00:59:15:16
Steph
They're great routes to push your self.

00:59:15:16 - 00:59:17:12
Steph
On if you're a little hesitant on lead.

00:59:17:15 - 00:59:37:20
Kyle
I just got, I got on Cloud Tower on Saturday, and, I had followed that third crux pitch twice, and it's my first time leading it, and it was just like, it's a splitter crack. And so like, you know, you do hard couple moves, find a stem and get a piece above your head, clip it and then you like rest and then you just keep you're basically on top rope the whole time.

00:59:37:22 - 00:59:52:20
Kyle
And it was fantastic. Yeah. And like, you know, I send it to my buddy and he just sounds like a laugh you face because he's like, he's definitely more of like the place less gear, bring less gear. I'm the guy who comes to the partnership. But we agree on a rack. And then I like, pull out five surprise cams.

00:59:52:22 - 01:00:12:19
Kyle
Yeah, I'm just like, surprised. You know, I'll carry these, you know, or I'll be at the top of the pitch. I'm like, hey, you want some extra cams? Like, but, yeah, it was just really cool. I, I'm just like, experiencing that more and more now. Or I know I did two takes in a fall. But, like, movement wise, felt good.

01:00:12:26 - 01:00:30:16
Kyle
Like I never was desperate. Like I found all the tiny feet on the left wall. All my gear placements were, like, really controlled and, like, precise and articulate. I just like. Yeah, next time, I think, like, if I gave it to two more burns, maybe I could probably pull it off.

01:00:30:17 - 01:00:30:21
Kyle
I

01:00:30:23 - 01:00:31:21
Steph
definitely need a next time.

01:00:31:21 - 01:00:33:27
Steph
I haven't let that pitch yet, so I need a, I.

01:00:33:27 - 01:00:37:04
Steph
Need to lead it and then I need the, the red point, you know.

01:00:37:06 - 01:00:56:02
Kyle
It's such a great pitch. I love, I love hard climbing, like, I. I'm a bad sport climber. Like, I can't climb overhung climbs, I can't, I don't practice climbing overhung climbs. I also don't really enjoy the movement too much for me. I love like technical climbing where it's hard, but it's restful in a way. If you do it right.

01:00:56:05 - 01:01:08:26
Kyle
Like, yeah, like Qatar's just a perfect example of that, you know, it's like a hard ass corner. But if you stem right, it's way easier. It's like, take the time to look for the microbiota. Like I love that like puzzle solving kind of think about it.

01:01:09:03 - 01:01:12:13
Steph
because you can, you can actually survey the crux and have the energy for it.

01:01:12:13 - 01:01:13:05
Steph
And

01:01:13:08 - 01:01:21:03
Steph
get your, you know, plan it all out. So yeah I mean that's that's my preferable coming to

01:01:21:03 - 01:01:25:04
Kyle
For sure. And my rock has so much of it. Yeah. So

01:01:25:06 - 01:01:44:17
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01:02:16:15 - 01:02:26:17
LIVSN
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01:02:26:19 - 01:02:33:24
Kyle
So, kind of earlier on. I don't know if it was on air or not. We were talking about,

01:02:33:26 - 01:02:48:15
Kyle
Just like safety philosophy. Risk philosophy. And, like, there's this element of chaos that we kind of put ourselves into. How do you reckon with that? Like, how are you rationalizing the kind of uncontrollable risk that we put ourselves in

01:02:48:17 - 01:02:48:27
Steph
As a

01:02:48:27 - 01:02:50:17
Kyle
clown?

01:02:50:19 - 01:02:54:04
Steph
I don't know if it's uncontrollable, though. You got. You got the gear, you got the rope,

01:02:54:06 - 01:02:54:28
Kyle
But there's like,

01:02:54:28 - 01:02:55:28
Steph
the choice of route.

01:02:56:02 - 01:03:18:03
Kyle
there's like, the like. Sure. Like there are definitely ways to like minimize the amount of chaos you expose yourself to. But in general, like I think that as a climber you are inherently exposed to chaos. Like whether it's like random ass rockfall or, like a decision that you missed, like, you know, you don't know what you don't know, like that whole aspect of it.

01:03:18:05 - 01:03:18:23
Kyle
How are you.

01:03:18:27 - 01:03:18:29
Kyle
What

01:03:18:29 - 01:03:22:28
Steph
what makes it engaging and exciting and, and that's, that's what keeps it from being.

01:03:22:28 - 01:03:28:03
Steph
Boring and what makes it a lifelong passion. You know, if it didn't have the unpredictable.

01:03:28:03 - 01:03:30:13
Steph
Nature, if it was just like.

01:03:30:15 - 01:03:31:20
Steph
Sport climbing, you know.

01:03:31:20 - 01:03:38:09
Steph
Like, or you just clipping bolts and you get into the top anchor and things are so controlled and so predictable.

01:03:38:11 - 01:03:42:24
Steph
You know, apart from how you're going to climb it, I think you're boring. Yeah.

01:03:42:24 - 01:03:50:10
Steph
So it keeps it keeps it interesting. I like the the you know, logistics in the constantly changing.

01:03:50:12 - 01:03:54:08
Steph
Dynamics of of any climb, like the weather, the partner.

01:03:54:11 - 01:03:56:01
Steph
The fatigue.

01:03:56:04 - 01:03:58:26
Steph
The temperature, lots of things.

01:03:58:28 - 01:04:21:13
Kyle
What do you feel? I have noticed a push. I think I've heard of specifically on the Front Range of Colorado, where there's a group of people that are like power bolters like they want to bring the gym style bolting to outdoors. Have you run into that before? How do you feel about this kind of bleaching, of climbing in that way?

01:04:21:15 - 01:04:31:07
Kyle
And is there any sort of sense of, like, worry about where the sport's going in that direction, or do you think that there's room for all and that will ultimately just kind of like find a, a balance point?

01:04:31:10 - 01:04:31:19
Steph
I, I.

01:04:31:19 - 01:04:33:04
Steph
Personally haven't experienced that.

01:04:33:04 - 01:04:37:18
Steph
Much. I think I'm more embedded in the adventure realm or that.

01:04:37:18 - 01:04:39:07
Steph
That kind of stuff just doesn't happen.

01:04:39:07 - 01:04:48:00
Steph
So much. You're not finding bolts way up there on. Yes. Some mountain in the wind rivers. So, you know, I'm just.

01:04:48:00 - 01:04:49:21
Steph
Not really part of that scene as much.

01:04:49:21 - 01:04:50:13
Steph
But I'm.

01:04:50:20 - 01:05:02:15
Steph
I'm all for bolts. If I'm if I'm going out to have a fun day, sport climbing, I, I would like it to be safely bolted with a nice bolted anchor. And I'm certainly all for bolted anchors, like having having bolted anchors on a root just.

01:05:02:15 - 01:05:02:24
Steph
Just.

01:05:03:01 - 01:05:04:02
Steph
Adds to the safety.

01:05:04:02 - 01:05:08:13
Steph
And the enjoyment. And I don't see any disadvantage to that kind of thing.

01:05:08:16 - 01:05:09:01
Kyle
Yeah.

01:05:09:04 - 01:05:14:09
Kyle
That's one of the reasons why I like red rocks so much is bolted anchors everywhere. It helps for SA to helps rescue.

01:05:14:12 - 01:05:14:23
Steph
yeah.

01:05:14:24 - 01:05:19:25
Steph
It's just it's helpful around. Yeah. I don't know who's getting to the bolt today and and saying I wish this weren't here.

01:05:19:25 - 01:05:22:09
Steph
And I'm, I want to build

01:05:22:11 - 01:05:48:27
Kyle
Yeah, exactly. I want to dive into a topic that I haven't done yet. And this is like I would say this podcast is primarily like a male audience. And I, I think the sport itself is kind of dominated by, by men in a way. Like just if you look at the demographics, I'm curious as to like to a male audience, like, what do we miss?

01:05:48:27 - 01:06:07:14
Kyle
Or maybe you misunderstand when it comes to like a female experience in climbing in the mountains, and this could be movement mentality. This could be emotions. Risk management partnerships. Like what in your experience have you found to be different or unique to the female experience in the mountains?

01:06:07:17 - 01:06:09:08
Steph
It's a good question. I haven't I'm really fun.

01:06:09:11 - 01:06:11:20
Steph
I've climbed with so many people over the years.

01:06:11:23 - 01:06:21:21
Steph
Most of them male. I do have some female partners.

01:06:21:23 - 01:06:23:12
Steph
I've never thought about it.

01:06:23:15 - 01:06:23:29
Steph
I think.

01:06:23:29 - 01:06:30:03
Steph
One thing I have. Okay, one thing I have thought about is when you're, you're.

01:06:30:03 - 01:06:31:11
Steph
Hiking in, like.

01:06:31:14 - 01:06:37:26
Steph
Maybe on a seven day trip where you're carrying packs or, or you're approaching a climb and you just kind of split the gear.

01:06:38:02 - 01:06:38:24
Steph
And and that's.

01:06:38:24 - 01:06:53:06
Steph
Fine. That makes sense that you're both partners. You're you're equal partners in this adventure. Why don't you split the gear? You both have a 45 pound pack, but for for me, carrying a 45 pound pack versus someone who weighs 50 pounds more than me carrying a 45 pound pack, it's like, oh, they're.

01:06:53:06 - 01:06:54:09
Steph
Floating along, you know.

01:06:54:09 - 01:07:07:18
Steph
Like it's so easy to just, like, stumbling along behind. I would say there's there's times where I'm just a little frustrated, but I also feel like that's it's hard one to bring up because it feels a little imbalanced.

01:07:07:18 - 01:07:10:01
Steph
To want to give someone else more gear, more.

01:07:10:01 - 01:07:11:28
Steph
Weight to take. But that is a.

01:07:11:28 - 01:07:13:00
Steph
Female male thing or.

01:07:13:00 - 01:07:20:02
Steph
A female just this isn't going to be as strong, usually like to carry as much weight.

01:07:20:05 - 01:07:29:05
Steph
But yeah, that's a minor thing. I just feel like it's making me stronger. But, it's it's pretty common. I don't know, I.

01:07:29:06 - 01:07:33:04
Steph
I haven't really thought about that, and I haven't really sensed, any issues.

01:07:33:04 - 01:07:35:10
Steph
Around it in my

01:07:35:13 - 01:07:38:03
Kyle
And. Yeah, I don't want to I don't want to pose it as an issue.

01:07:38:06 - 01:07:42:27
Steph
No, it's not an issue, I guess, but it hasn't been something I really thought about. Yeah.

01:07:42:29 - 01:08:05:01
Kyle
Someone, had another female upcoming partner of mine had said that, she was postulating that, maybe like a female is more in tune with maybe some sort of objective risk or more attuned to risks in general, where men might be kind of more disposition to be blind to them. Have you seen that in practice at all?

01:08:05:04 - 01:08:07:14
Steph
I have not know.

01:08:07:17 - 01:08:25:08
Steph
Perhaps because I'm not like this overly cautious kind of climber either. So I feel like some of my partners are more, I would say, more attuned to risk than I am, although it's always there for me. I just I tend to yeah, some risks are just so unlikely to happen kind of.

01:08:25:08 - 01:08:37:06
Steph
Thing or I'm willing to accept them more than some, you know, like, if it starts raining, we'll figure it out, you know? But, you know, I had no, I've not seen that, in, in my climbing that.

01:08:37:09 - 01:08:44:07
Kyle
What about the the difference in your experience from a female to female climbing partnership and a male to female partnership?

01:08:44:12 - 01:08:44:14
Steph
is.

01:08:44:14 - 01:08:44:23
Steph
Definitely.

01:08:44:23 - 01:08:47:21
Steph
Different.

01:08:47:24 - 01:08:54:10
Steph
What you talk about during the climb and on the approach is it's definitely different. Like you'll talk about completely different subjects.

01:08:54:12 - 01:08:56:21
Kyle
Do you have some examples.

01:08:56:23 - 01:09:05:22
Steph
Well the females you're talking more about your life and your relationships and all that kind of stuff. And with males you're talking about work and career.

01:09:05:22 - 01:09:09:05
Steph
And, other climbs and, you know.

01:09:09:05 - 01:09:14:01
Steph
Just kind of it's just a different conversation. And I like both.

01:09:14:04 - 01:09:14:28
Steph
Yeah, I.

01:09:14:28 - 01:09:18:08
Steph
I've, I've had such good times with both, both,

01:09:18:15 - 01:09:23:04
Steph
Female male partners, different dynamics, but both great.

01:09:23:07 - 01:09:37:28
Kyle
You had said recently that, you know, partnerships has kind of come into the limelight of your attention, and it's kind of become more important than the adventure or the objective. Talk to me about that transition, what happened and why is that something that's focus, your focus.

01:09:37:28 - 01:09:38:04
Kyle
Now,

01:09:38:04 - 01:09:38:10
Steph
Yeah.

01:09:38:10 - 01:09:40:28
Steph
When I first started climbing, it was all about the objective.

01:09:41:01 - 01:09:46:11
Steph
Like, I would just find any partner I could to go do an objective and,

01:09:46:13 - 01:09:49:28
Steph
You know, that was kind of a sad way of doing things, I think, you know,

01:09:49:28 - 01:09:50:01
Kyle
in.

01:09:50:01 - 01:09:51:02
Kyle
Retrospect or.

01:09:51:02 - 01:09:52:27
Steph
retrospect. Yeah. I mean.

01:09:53:00 - 01:09:54:15
Steph
To.

01:09:54:17 - 01:09:55:21
Steph
You know, just to find.

01:09:55:21 - 01:09:56:24
Steph
Anyone and then to be.

01:09:57:01 - 01:10:03:19
Steph
By you, you know. Good day. But that was a short lived. Yeah. Over time, as I climbed more and and very quickly.

01:10:03:22 - 01:10:09:05
Steph
Into to my climbing career, I began to really value my climbing partners and, and who I climb with. And.

01:10:09:07 - 01:10:10:20
Steph
You know, the good times would have.

01:10:10:20 - 01:10:13:12
Steph
Around the climb and what we'd talk about. And, you know, the.

01:10:13:13 - 01:10:14:14
Steph
Friendship that developed.

01:10:14:14 - 01:10:22:05
Steph
Around climbing, climbing together and, and certainly now, like, partnership is the main thing for me that.

01:10:22:05 - 01:10:25:03
Steph
I, I truly value a day spent out with, with a good.

01:10:25:03 - 01:10:26:10
Steph
Friend and climbing partner.

01:10:26:10 - 01:10:29:20
Steph
Over the actual objective.

01:10:29:22 - 01:10:34:28
Steph
The, you know, the Shangri-La is when they the line and you're, you're climbing the objective.

01:10:34:28 - 01:10:35:14
Steph
You both want to.

01:10:35:14 - 01:10:43:03
Steph
Climb and you're you're just in a great partnership, great friendship. And that happens usually. I mean, usually they come hand-in-hand here.

01:10:43:05 - 01:10:45:25
Steph
It's a great partnership. You also have the same.

01:10:45:25 - 01:10:50:25
Steph
Kind of adventurous streak. And you, you look for the same thing. So.

01:10:50:27 - 01:11:05:26
Kyle
You, you sometimes describe yourself as like, a shy and awkward and maybe a little bit, what's the word? Introverted. But it seems like you're constantly climbing with the new people. Yeah.

01:11:05:28 - 01:11:14:03
Steph
It's my. It's my first way to, to socialize, I think. Yeah. Without climbing, I don't know where I'd be,

01:11:14:05 - 01:11:18:18
Steph
Hiding in a in my in my van all alone. I don't know,

01:11:18:20 - 01:11:26:12
Steph
Yeah. I'm. I'm definitely an introvert. Definitely shy and awkward. And I social situations terrify me. Like going to a party.

01:11:26:12 - 01:11:27:09
Steph
I haven't gone.

01:11:27:09 - 01:11:28:26
Steph
To many parties in college.

01:11:28:26 - 01:11:31:00
Steph
I just kind of studied, you know, like, I.

01:11:31:04 - 01:11:33:20
Steph
I never went to a single party.

01:11:33:23 - 01:11:36:15
Steph
You know, big get togethers are just terrifying for me.

01:11:36:15 - 01:11:39:08
Steph
But, you know, I'm on the road a lot, and.

01:11:39:08 - 01:11:46:05
Steph
I need partners. And so I go on a mountain project or, you know, I kind of, you know, Instagram message through my friends.

01:11:46:05 - 01:11:46:29
Steph
I'm like, or.

01:11:47:06 - 01:11:48:07
Steph
Contacts and I.

01:11:48:07 - 01:11:49:00
Steph
I'm like, you want to.

01:11:49:00 - 01:11:52:04
Steph
Climb. So I'm constantly meeting new people and interacting with new people.

01:11:52:04 - 01:11:52:24
Steph
And, you know.

01:11:52:26 - 01:11:56:23
Steph
You spend the entire day with them. And obviously, like you talk about like things.

01:11:56:23 - 01:11:59:13
Steph
In your life, stories come out and, you know.

01:11:59:16 - 01:12:01:05
Steph
You talk about big things with people.

01:12:01:05 - 01:12:05:09
Steph
You hardly know. And it's it's kind of cool. And it's definitely a social.

01:12:05:11 - 01:12:08:10
Steph
Social outlet for me in a way of me to.

01:12:08:12 - 01:12:11:17
Steph
Be more comfortable around people and just, you know, picking.

01:12:11:17 - 01:12:13:04
Steph
Up a conversation.

01:12:13:06 - 01:12:15:20
Kyle
Has it always been that way, the introverted kind of.

01:12:15:25 - 01:12:16:02
Steph
I.

01:12:16:02 - 01:12:21:06
Steph
I still am like, I it's just I view myself as a very awkward person socially.

01:12:21:06 - 01:12:23:00
Steph
And even around friends.

01:12:23:00 - 01:12:28:05
Steph
That I've known for years, it's just, you know, I'm we get back from a climb, they're like, hey, we want to go out.

01:12:28:05 - 01:12:31:19
Steph
And do dinner. You want to do you want to watch a movie? I'm like, no, I.

01:12:31:19 - 01:12:36:06
Steph
Work on my trip reports. Yeah. Like I'm just. I'm just naturally just kind of.

01:12:36:06 - 01:12:38:19
Steph
I want to focus on my own stuff. But yeah.

01:12:38:19 - 01:12:53:13
Steph
It's a climb. It's been a great way for me to to socialize and me, a lot of people and and be more comfortable. And I, I taught math as well for like six years at a university and I would have classes over 200 students. And so, at that time, I was also I had.

01:12:53:13 - 01:12:54:04
Steph
Been a climber.

01:12:54:04 - 01:12:54:10
Steph
For a.

01:12:54:10 - 01:12:55:02
Steph
While, and I'm.

01:12:55:02 - 01:12:57:29
Steph
Not sure that I could have gotten myself to be comfortable, like.

01:12:57:29 - 01:12:59:27
Steph
Lecturing all the students if I hadn't.

01:12:59:27 - 01:13:02:29
Steph
Already, you know, gotten comfortable just.

01:13:03:01 - 01:13:06:21
Steph
Meeting a random partner and talking with them all day. So, yeah.

01:13:06:25 - 01:13:11:10
Kyle
Was, was this something that, kind of sparked your anxiety a little bit?

01:13:11:13 - 01:13:15:28
Steph
No, no, no, see, I'm getting better. I'm getting better. But it's not a party. It's not.

01:13:16:00 - 01:13:16:13
Steph
You know, it's

01:13:16:13 - 01:13:18:18
Kyle
not.

01:13:18:20 - 01:13:19:28
Kyle
Just a conversation.

01:13:20:01 - 01:13:20:10
Kyle
Yeah.

01:13:20:13 - 01:13:20:22
Steph
I feel.

01:13:20:22 - 01:13:21:27
Steph
Like it kind of depends on the.

01:13:21:27 - 01:13:27:09
Steph
Expectations. And, you know, the social expectations involved. Yeah.

01:13:27:12 - 01:13:41:14
Kyle
Meeting strangers in general, I think, can be a little bit of a crapshoot. How do you vet someone before you climb with them? You just. You just, like, blindfold, shotgun, go into it.

01:13:41:19 - 01:13:41:29
Steph
Yeah.

01:13:42:03 - 01:13:42:26
Steph
People don't like.

01:13:42:26 - 01:13:43:23
Steph
Em. You.

01:13:43:23 - 01:13:47:03
Steph
Know, so my friends don't believe me, but I do not Google people. I do not.

01:13:47:05 - 01:13:52:19
Kyle
Or, I mean, like, you don't have, like, specific questions to try to get a vibe or.

01:13:52:19 - 01:14:04:16
Steph
No, I don't I mean, usually there's some vetting involved just in the whole process of finding them as a partner. So like the other day, I, I climbed with the guy I had never climb with before, and I, I saw his post.

01:14:04:16 - 01:14:05:15
Steph
On on Mountain.

01:14:05:15 - 01:14:10:04
Steph
Project looking for a partner in Red rocks and he listed some route. I was like, oh, those are all good routes.

01:14:10:04 - 01:14:11:25
Steph
I've done them all and they're great and.

01:14:11:25 - 01:14:14:27
Steph
I'd happily do any of them again. This guy's looking for routes that.

01:14:14:27 - 01:14:17:08
Steph
Are fun and he's probably pretty competent.

01:14:17:14 - 01:14:25:12
Steph
And past that, I didn't look into his name. I didn't look at his list. I didn't look to see where he's from, how old he was. I just was like, let's do it. And we had a great day together.

01:14:25:15 - 01:14:26:14
Steph
So.

01:14:26:17 - 01:14:28:16
Steph
And we're planning another climb, planned.

01:14:28:16 - 01:14:40:21
Steph
Meetup in May, so it's, I don't know, it kind of I think you get a sense from if I'm looking on Mountain project for partners, partner posts. I just kind of look at their posts and it it gives me a sense of, of.

01:14:40:21 - 01:14:41:14
Steph
Them.

01:14:41:17 - 01:14:44:09
Steph
Hoping their post is honest, which it always has.

01:14:44:09 - 01:14:44:16
Steph
Been

01:14:44:21 - 01:14:46:16
Kyle
You've never been catfished in that way.

01:14:46:19 - 01:14:48:10
Steph
No, I haven't.

01:14:48:12 - 01:15:02:28
Steph
And if I make a post and I get responses, I think, yeah, maybe there's some vetting that goes on just in the way that they contact me. Yeah. What kind of vibe do I get from their contact? But I don't usually ask them okay. What what have you done? You know what. What's your level.

01:15:03:00 - 01:15:03:21
Steph
You know, have.

01:15:03:28 - 01:15:09:16
Steph
You are you fishing? How many years you climb? I don't usually go that far. I'm just like, oh, this person sounds cool. Let's do it.

01:15:09:18 - 01:15:24:17
Kyle
Because I've I've heard anecdotes of people, you know, finding partners that say this and that big talk. And then when it comes down to it, they're on lead and it's like 15ft off the ground. They get the Elvis leg and it's like, don't know how to place gear. Like never run into anything like that.

01:15:24:21 - 01:15:25:22
Steph
I have not know.

01:15:25:22 - 01:15:33:03
Steph
And I think, you know, if I'm posting on Mount Project Partners, I'm always posting routes and like, okay, I would lead this.

01:15:33:03 - 01:15:36:17
Steph
Whole thing if needed. So,

01:15:36:20 - 01:15:48:21
Steph
You know, it's it's it's less threatening. If that would happen, I'd be like, I'll just take the sharpening, okay. With that. And usually they would they would be, you know, that that certainly happened where the partner just wasn't really wanting to lead. And they're happy to follow.

01:15:48:21 - 01:15:50:06
Steph
And you know, they're they're competent.

01:15:50:06 - 01:15:53:28
Steph
So yeah, I, I've never had a bad experience.

01:15:54:00 - 01:16:06:04
Kyle
You never worry about safety. I, I think I've heard like some females like, talk about, like, you know, meeting random guy, like some time can be kind of, like, coded, being like, you know, air quotes, dangerous or anything like that.

01:16:06:07 - 01:16:06:17
Steph
I've

01:16:06:17 - 01:16:07:16
Kyle
not on your radar at all.

01:16:07:21 - 01:16:10:01
Steph
I've never worried about it and never experienced it.

01:16:10:04 - 01:16:14:03
Steph
I think partly because my name is very known.

01:16:14:05 - 01:16:18:21
Steph
There's, I think that does a little self screening.

01:16:18:24 - 01:16:25:12
Steph
Because I have gotten like say I post on Mountain Project looking for a partner. I might get a lot of responses and some of them are like, hey, I'm.

01:16:25:14 - 01:16:26:09
Steph
I'm nowhere near.

01:16:26:09 - 01:16:36:18
Steph
Like climbing at your level, but I really, you know, I like your topo, thank you so much. And it's like, oh, they're not even really looking to climb, but they're they're willing to admit their level a bit more because.

01:16:36:20 - 01:16:40:07
Steph
I think, you know, I'm going to make a trip report, I don't know.

01:16:40:09 - 01:16:47:10
Steph
Watch out. You know, I don't know, I've just I've just I've had such good luck. And I think most climbers are our stand up people.

01:16:47:10 - 01:16:49:03
Steph
And, you know.

01:16:49:05 - 01:17:03:20
Kyle
For someone who is struggling to find partners, because I, I've definitely spoken to several people who have gotten to the point where they just top of solo because they just cannot find consistent partnership. What advice do you have to someone like that?

01:17:03:23 - 01:17:05:02
Steph
Well, it's hard to find consistent.

01:17:05:02 - 01:17:06:19
Steph
Partners, you know, like.

01:17:06:22 - 01:17:14:06
Steph
In the partner that you climbed several routes with. For me, that's always been someone who started as a one time and then just ended up.

01:17:14:09 - 01:17:15:21
Steph
Clicking as a partner, or.

01:17:15:21 - 01:17:18:20
Steph
We would go to the same places and was like, hey, let's climb for a week.

01:17:18:20 - 01:17:19:19
Steph
Together. And then.

01:17:19:22 - 01:17:20:22
Steph
It's like, oh, let's climb for another.

01:17:20:22 - 01:17:32:19
Steph
Week. And you know, that's how all my, my, current main partners were once just random. I don't know.

01:17:32:21 - 01:17:39:03
Steph
I haven't struggled so much with that. I think posting them on project, reading posts.

01:17:39:03 - 01:17:45:03
Steph
And responding, I might have a little name recognition, a recognition that's helping me there.

01:17:45:06 - 01:17:51:21
Steph
These days. I do get a lot an Instagram messages of people in the area. They're like, hey, I see you in Red rocks. One climb and I got a few this.

01:17:51:21 - 01:17:52:29
Steph
Time, and that's.

01:17:52:29 - 01:17:53:19
Steph
Been really cool.

01:17:53:19 - 01:18:03:12
Steph
That's been new, since I started Instagram. And that's been a really cool way to find partners. And I don't have to try. That is. Yeah.

01:18:03:15 - 01:18:05:16
Steph
Yeah. It's hard to give advice because I, I think.

01:18:05:17 - 01:18:10:01
Steph
I'm like, in a position that's a little

01:18:10:04 - 01:18:34:08
Kyle
I'm in the same situation. I, my Instagram has been just instrumental, in building a community. And, you know, I think there's also a level of street cred that you get just based on the climbs that you post. And so, you know, because every climb that you climb, it says a lot about you, you know, whether or not just a technical ability, but like, who are you to be able to think that you can do it, that you actually do it?

01:18:34:08 - 01:18:57:19
Kyle
Like, are you hiking back? Like, there's so many things that a root says about a human. And so when you see that someone is climbing something like, they're okay, like, there's so much I have in common with this person already. And, yeah, I think, I mean, you know, I don't really want to promote a bunch of more people to be like, you know, I don't know, the whole influencer thing is like a weird topic or whatever.

01:18:57:22 - 01:19:26:11
Kyle
But I think that social media in the beginning was meant to be a tool to build communities in the first place, not just like brain rot content where you, like, are actually interacting with anybody. Right. And I think that is a lot like if you can use it for what it's meant for, it's a huge tool and you don't need like tons of followers, you don't need to be a business, like just post who you are and what you climb and like, reach out to other people that might be of interest and like, yeah, I think you can really use it as a tool.

01:19:26:17 - 01:19:26:27
Kyle
Yeah, I.

01:19:26:27 - 01:19:26:28
Steph
I.

01:19:26:28 - 01:19:37:05
Steph
I, I feel like Instagram especially and Facebook, I feel like such a community. They're with my followers and it's great. It's kind of accidentally happened or I didn't expect it to happen.

01:19:37:05 - 01:19:38:18
Steph
And it's been pretty cool.

01:19:38:21 - 01:19:55:10
Kyle
Mean it's cool and it's nice to I think some people they'll like go in it with just like the chasing of the number. They're like, I'm going to create content where I can get more followers, but they lack the whole, like interacting with the community that you're building. It's like, that's the best part. It's like, comment back with these people.

01:19:55:10 - 01:20:05:27
Kyle
DM these people like, these are real people. These are real people on the other side of the screen, like. And you can like everyone's so desperate for like human connection these days. It's like, just connect with these people. Yeah.

01:20:05:29 - 01:20:27:14
Kyle
Let's be real for a second. The blueprint for a successful climbing podcast is simple. Interview the most famous climbers in the world. Big names mean big followings. Lots of SEO power and a built in audience that helps promote every episode. But this show, this show has never been about that. From the beginning, it has been my mission to bring you stories from the climbing majority.

01:20:27:14 - 01:20:46:11
Kyle
The climbers who don't live in the limelight, the ones who quietly put up roots, build communities and help give back in ways that are rarely recognized. And while that's what makes this show special, it also means we have an uphill battle when it comes to growth. And that is where you come in. If you believe in the show, if you've been fired up, inspired by an episode.

01:20:46:13 - 01:21:07:21
Kyle
Word of Mouth is the single most powerful way to help the show share an episode with a friend. Post about us on social media. Jump on to Reddit threads and Mountain project forums and tell people what you've been listening to. Also, I am on a mission to beat Climbing Gold Spotify review account. If you haven't already left the show a review, please head on over to Spotify to give this show five stars.

01:21:07:22 - 01:21:10:16
Kyle
We only have 1000 more ratings to go.

01:21:10:19 - 01:21:21:08
Kyle
From you had mentioned like a partner turning from like a first experience to like a lifetime partner or someone you do multiple objective with.

01:21:21:11 - 01:21:29:02
Kyle
For you, what kind of person ends up becoming that, that kind of partner that you climb with a lot?

01:21:29:05 - 01:21:29:20
Steph
Someone who has.

01:21:29:20 - 01:21:38:19
Steph
The same style of climbing, the same kind of objectives? Yeah, that's that's probably the number one thing is, are we psyched about the same things?

01:21:38:22 - 01:21:39:00
Steph
Are we.

01:21:39:00 - 01:21:40:27
Steph
Of the same similar skill level to go.

01:21:40:27 - 01:21:42:17
Steph
About those things?

01:21:42:20 - 01:21:53:09
Steph
Schedule. You know, that's that's been one thing where, you know, partners might end up having kids and then their schedule drastically changes or becomes like.

01:21:53:12 - 01:21:55:13
Steph
Non-existent for climbing for a while.

01:21:55:13 - 01:21:57:22
Steph
And yeah, that that definitely puts a pinch.

01:21:57:22 - 01:22:06:18
Steph
On, on climbing, you know, with a partner if their schedule is different, or temporarily different. Yeah.

01:22:06:21 - 01:22:16:15
Kyle
That's poof. So high poof. He's a he's a good boy.

01:22:16:18 - 01:22:17:02
Steph
Yeah.

01:22:17:05 - 01:22:19:02
Steph
I think it's about having the common.

01:22:19:04 - 01:22:25:10
Steph
Objectives and climbing styles. Like, I really like efficiency and moving fast and covering a lot of.

01:22:25:10 - 01:22:27:25
Steph
Ground and going for adventurous routes. And when you find.

01:22:27:25 - 01:22:28:28
Steph
The person who's like.

01:22:28:28 - 01:22:30:28
Steph
That, normally it's like, okay, we're going to climb a lot.

01:22:30:28 - 01:22:33:17
Steph
Together. Yeah. So actually I'm climbing with.

01:22:33:17 - 01:22:34:16
Steph
Sean McClain

01:22:34:22 - 01:22:37:04
Kyle
Yeah. You guys have been doing a lot of stuff together.

01:22:37:07 - 01:22:49:22
Steph
Yeah, we did a lot. We, after that one day in red box last year, we ended up climbing a lot in Zion together, and I'm like, hey, let's let's climb together some more because we just kind of just want to climbing streak there. And it was, you know, same page kind of stuff.

01:22:49:22 - 01:22:53:17
Steph
And, yeah. So we're we're gonna meet up soon, climb another week.

01:22:53:17 - 01:22:54:09
Steph
So

01:22:54:12 - 01:22:56:01
Steph
that kind of partner where you just kind of meet in one.

01:22:56:01 - 01:22:56:22
Steph
Sense, like, hey.

01:22:56:29 - 01:22:58:00
Steph
We should climb more. So.

01:22:58:06 - 01:23:21:09
Kyle
Yeah. Yeah. It's so interesting. Like the can't like. I think the conversation shared between the partnership to me is probably one of the most important parts because like, if I'm just with the partner and there's just like you're not chatting on the approach, you know, you're just like, we're just here to climb or go. It's like you're missing out on this whole other portion of it.

01:23:21:12 - 01:23:22:23
Kyle
Yeah. Sorry. Yeah.

01:23:22:26 - 01:23:25:01
Steph
too. Like, did you enjoy the, the time with.

01:23:25:01 - 01:23:26:15
Steph
The person outside?

01:23:26:17 - 01:23:27:17
Steph
So the fact that you were

01:23:27:24 - 01:23:47:22
Kyle
the did you talk about something other than climbing? That's a big one for me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, yeah. As you already talked about it a little bit today, but yeah. Like, when I'm like hiking on approaches to like, big climbs, like, I have some deep conversations with people like that. You you don't even know, that you.

01:23:47:24 - 01:23:57:11
Kyle
Yeah. There's something about the outdoors and and something about that that just, like, brings that out and like, so much honesty and and, it's healing. Yeah. It's therapeutic.

01:23:57:14 - 01:23:59:12
Steph
It is using your judgment which is, is.

01:23:59:12 - 01:24:04:24
Steph
Kind of is and yeah. Between you know on a climb. Right. You know when you're talking about in life

01:24:04:24 - 01:24:06:20
Kyle
stuff.

01:24:06:22 - 01:24:27:25
Kyle
Yeah. It's it's pretty hard to be judgmental in person. I feel like it's so much judgment is like just through a screen or through, you know, when the person's not in the room or whatever. Yeah. It's interesting. You've kind of like a bunch of different people. Have you, like, learned anything specific about interacting with so many different people?

01:24:27:28 - 01:24:32:27
Kyle
Something about humanity or about climbing in general, or something about yourself?

01:24:33:00 - 01:24:37:24
Steph
Well, one thing I really like about climbing with so many different people is you learn all these cool tricks, like you're constantly.

01:24:37:24 - 01:24:42:16
Steph
Learning a new method to do something or just a new style of doing something.

01:24:42:19 - 01:24:52:00
Steph
And so you develop this whole quiver of ways to do things from all the people you've met. So I really like that aspect. And everyone comes at climbing from a different direction. You know.

01:24:52:00 - 01:24:55:16
Steph
Some people come at it from a sport climbing mindset, and they're getting.

01:24:55:16 - 01:25:16:20
Steph
Into this, this trad venture stuff where they come at it from purely adventure trad side and, yeah, maybe they've only climbed for a few years, maybe to climb for three decades, you know. So there's, there's this all these, these different ways of coming about getting to this particular route you're climbing. And, you know, it's always pretty cool to.

01:25:16:22 - 01:25:17:01
Steph
Yeah.

01:25:17:01 - 01:25:19:27
Steph
I, I enjoy I enjoy the variety.

01:25:19:29 - 01:25:29:18
Kyle
Yeah, yeah, it's definitely nice to like, crowdsource information like that. Like, oh, learn this from this person, learn this from this person. And you start to, like, build like your quiver, like you said. And to get more and more efficient.

01:25:29:20 - 01:25:30:03
Steph
And I love.

01:25:30:03 - 01:25:32:28
Steph
It when I can show someone who's like, really experience a new.

01:25:32:28 - 01:25:34:19
Steph
Trick. It's like, hey.

01:25:34:19 - 01:25:38:08
Steph
Yeah, I learned something. I have something that's it's it's pretty.

01:25:38:08 - 01:25:40:00
Steph
Cool that they didn't know.

01:25:40:02 - 01:25:53:09
Kyle
I had one of those recently. Like when you're rappelling instead of needing like if it's windy or something like that, or you're worried about your knots getting, stuck from below, instead of saddle bagging or doing anything like that, just tie it to yourself.

01:25:53:09 - 01:25:58:01
Steph
Exactly. And we did that yesterday or two days ago on on Fiddler on the roof because it was it was so windy.

01:25:58:01 - 01:25:59:13
Steph
Yeah, it's a great one.

01:25:59:18 - 01:26:20:14
Kyle
such a great trick. Yeah. You had, in your write up. You gave me, you said you started dating in 2020. Yeah. Is that dating again or dating in general? Dating in general. So 37, you had not had a boyfriend or any sort of romantic partnership. Was that.

01:26:20:17 - 01:26:21:24
Steph
Didn't want it. Didn't care.

01:26:21:24 - 01:26:27:25
Steph
I just wanted to be on the road and free and had an adventure. And I think, you know, I realize that. Yeah, I did maybe.

01:26:27:25 - 01:26:30:06
Steph
Want it, but thought. No, I'm not. I'm not.

01:26:30:06 - 01:26:31:05
Steph
Established yet.

01:26:31:05 - 01:26:37:03
Steph
I don't I'm not living here full time. I'm still in a move. So when I lived in Bellingham, for instance.

01:26:37:03 - 01:26:39:26
Steph
I lived there for like eight years.

01:26:39:29 - 01:26:45:01
Steph
And I was like, I'm not staying here. I know I'm going to move. I'm going to you go to Colorado.

01:26:45:01 - 01:26:50:06
Steph
And so I, I did go to Colorado, and I think it was when I moved to Colorado that I thought, okay, this is I think I've.

01:26:50:06 - 01:26:51:22
Steph
Found where I'm going to be.

01:26:51:24 - 01:27:01:15
Steph
I was working on a PhD and I bought the home and I was like, this is I think this is my forever place. Colorado and I, I think I just opened myself up to the.

01:27:01:15 - 01:27:02:12
Steph
Idea of dating.

01:27:02:12 - 01:27:04:20
Steph
And actually, I met a guy within.

01:27:04:20 - 01:27:08:04
Steph
A month of living in Colorado, and that's who I started dating.

01:27:08:06 - 01:27:09:15
Steph
And I always had this.

01:27:09:18 - 01:27:12:21
Steph
Like underlying rule of don't date climbing partners, you know.

01:27:12:22 - 01:27:22:06
Steph
Like it's it's about the climb. We're not on a date here. And so, this guy ended up being a climbing partner. So not only was it my first relationship, but also it was dating.

01:27:22:06 - 01:27:23:11
Steph
A climbing partner.

01:27:23:14 - 01:27:24:20
Steph
Which I don't know.

01:27:24:20 - 01:27:34:23
Steph
I think, you know, we're no longer together, and I'm not sure I might I might want to keep that rule of don't, don't date your main climbing partner. There's a dynamic there that that complicates

01:27:34:29 - 01:27:35:19
Kyle
the climb.

01:27:35:22 - 01:27:48:16
Kyle
Yeah, I, I spoke to someone recently, and it's, if you want to, like, if you want to date somebody, date them first and then climb after. They don't use climbing as a segue to try to date someone.

01:27:48:19 - 01:27:50:15
Steph
Although that wasn't how it was for us. It

01:27:50:20 - 01:27:52:17
Kyle
I'm not suggesting that it was. Yeah.

01:27:52:19 - 01:27:54:15
Steph
But I think I did conclude that.

01:27:54:18 - 01:27:55:07
Steph
I want to keep.

01:27:55:07 - 01:27:56:18
Steph
My relationship apart.

01:27:56:18 - 01:27:58:11
Steph
From my main climbing partner.

01:27:58:11 - 01:28:03:12
Steph
Like, I just think it was if we had different objectives.

01:28:03:12 - 01:28:11:09
Steph
There were more arguments that went on then needed. I think, you know, on the climb and stuff. And so. Yeah, but I,

01:28:11:12 - 01:28:13:15
Steph
Definitely open to the idea of dating. It's just a.

01:28:13:15 - 01:28:15:13
Steph
Matter of, you know, finding the.

01:28:15:13 - 01:28:16:00
Steph
Right person who.

01:28:16:00 - 01:28:18:02
Steph
Can fit my life. Which my life right now.

01:28:18:02 - 01:28:19:16
Steph
On the road is a little difficult for.

01:28:19:16 - 01:28:22:19
Steph
That, but I don't plan to be on the road forever.

01:28:22:21 - 01:28:33:25
Kyle
You, You said that it's been, like, difficult to have relationships. Is that prior to 37, that kind of portion, or are you saying even even nowadays, it's kind of, been difficult in a way.

01:28:33:28 - 01:28:42:00
Steph
think prior to being 37, I just kind of was like, I'm not in the right and not established here, and I do not want to be in a long distance relationship, like, I just.

01:28:42:00 - 01:28:43:21
Steph
Don't want to be. And.

01:28:43:21 - 01:28:49:16
Steph
So I just kind of wanted to feel like I was established. But maybe I need to change that idea, because right.

01:28:49:16 - 01:28:51:04
Steph
Now, I have no idea where I'm going to establish.

01:28:51:04 - 01:28:51:20
Steph
Myself.

01:28:51:20 - 01:28:56:01
Steph
So, yeah, I'm kind of more open now, I think, to change, and.

01:28:56:02 - 01:28:57:26
Steph
To that idea of.

01:28:57:29 - 01:28:58:03
Steph
I.

01:28:58:03 - 01:28:59:22
Steph
Could kind of go wherever.

01:28:59:22 - 01:29:02:23
Steph
You know, if I've met someone, I could go over there. So.

01:29:02:25 - 01:29:03:10
Steph
Yeah,

01:29:03:13 - 01:29:33:05
Kyle
There's an analogy, that someone put together and it's about like, trying to find a life partner later in life. And he, he says he attributes like your life experience and who you are towards like, decorating a room, like you have a room and you've, you've lived in it for 37 years and you have picked the color couch, you've picked the colored table, you've picked the right silverware like you, everything has been curtailed to to who you are as an individual.

01:29:33:07 - 01:29:52:01
Kyle
And the last thing you got to pick is a lamp. And the lamps got to match everything. It's got to be it's got a vibe with the room. It's got to have the feng shui. It's going to be the hardest lamp to find in the world. Whereas if you try to find a lamp with a very sparse apartment, you haven't really occurred to like the lamp is going to be easy.

01:29:52:01 - 01:30:10:21
Kyle
It doesn't really matter. You know, you the the decision is less, impactful. And the relation here is like the older we get, the more our room is filled and the more customize it is. So we try to find a life partner. We try to find that lamp. There's less compromise. You know, we already are solid in who we are.

01:30:10:21 - 01:30:28:06
Kyle
And it's very hard to have two people that have done that kind of mesh and find uniqueness. And, you know, there's less compromise. Do you resonate with that? Is that something that kind of has been part of the the problem in a way, or like talk to me about that experience

01:30:28:09 - 01:30:31:21
Steph
like now I kind of especially these last couple of years.

01:30:31:21 - 01:30:33:11
Steph
And like, even now.

01:30:33:11 - 01:30:37:20
Steph
Where I've just fully moved into my van this week.

01:30:37:22 - 01:30:38:28
Steph
I just feel like I.

01:30:39:03 - 01:30:39:18
Steph
Am not.

01:30:39:18 - 01:30:43:29
Steph
Worried anymore about the future, and I don't know what the future holds. I'm kind of excited about.

01:30:43:29 - 01:30:52:27
Steph
The unknown and that I don't know where I'm going to live. I don't know who I'm going to find and whether they're going to be a climber or not.

01:30:52:29 - 01:30:54:12
Steph
You know, all of those things are kind.

01:30:54:12 - 01:30:55:27
Steph
Of up in the air, and I don't I.

01:30:55:27 - 01:31:00:01
Steph
Don't care too much like I don't it's not like I've, I had a specific person.

01:31:00:01 - 01:31:01:29
Steph
In mind that I want to find.

01:31:02:01 - 01:31:04:18
Kyle
So in a way, your your room is less full now.

01:31:04:19 - 01:31:04:23
Kyle
I

01:31:04:25 - 01:31:10:17
Steph
feel like I have shipped a lot of it by in the last couple of years by just kind of like losing my job and.

01:31:10:19 - 01:31:11:10
Steph
You know.

01:31:11:13 - 01:31:13:09
Steph
Losing my house or renting it out, at least.

01:31:13:17 - 01:31:15:11
Steph
Moving into my car, kind of.

01:31:15:11 - 01:31:19:27
Steph
Really just simplifying my life, not just being in a van. And I don't even have a place to live other.

01:31:19:27 - 01:31:23:23
Steph
Than my van. And it can be wherever it wants to be. And I am pretty open.

01:31:23:23 - 01:31:27:06
Steph
Right now to whatever life throws at me, which is kind of a.

01:31:27:09 - 01:31:29:26
Steph
Very, it's,

01:31:29:28 - 01:31:31:00
Steph
What's so the word for.

01:31:31:00 - 01:31:33:00
Steph
It?

01:31:33:03 - 01:31:36:20
Steph
Like, I feel like the stress is just kind of washed out of my life.

01:31:36:22 - 01:31:38:05
Steph
It's it's nice.

01:31:38:05 - 01:31:38:21
Kyle
That's cool.

01:31:38:26 - 01:31:39:21
Steph
Yeah.

01:31:39:23 - 01:31:42:00
Steph
Hopefully that lasts.

01:31:42:03 - 01:31:45:11
Steph
But, yeah, I, I feel like I have kind of cleaned out that room.

01:31:45:11 - 01:31:49:12
Steph
I've done some spring cleaning and took it all out, and it's kind of a bit more bare now.

01:31:49:12 - 01:32:16:09
Kyle
I like that. Yeah. That's cool. I mean, reminds me of, like, I don't know, like in my early 20s, it was kind of similar, like it just seedier pants, like wherever you want to go. Every day is new. There's a sense of freedom there. And, yeah, it's, I think that's like, why the whole dirtbag like lifestyle is so, glorified or it's just because, like, yeah, you wake up every day and something's new, you know, routine is what does it say?

01:32:16:09 - 01:32:36:17
Kyle
Routine is the oh, gosh. I think like the opposite of this phrase is like novelties, the cure to like, time passing too quickly and like routine is the opposite. It's like, that's how you just make it time evaporate. You look back six years and you're just like, oh, I raised a kid. I went to the same job six days a week.

01:32:36:18 - 01:32:45:12
Kyle
You know, I watch the same movie or whatever. And like, that's when life just starts to evaporate. And I think right now in your situation, the cycle and time slows down.

01:32:45:20 - 01:32:48:26
Steph
I think I successfully executed my midlife crisis.

01:32:48:29 - 01:32:51:16
Steph
And, I'm on the other end of it now, and I'm.

01:32:51:17 - 01:32:53:03
Steph
Back in my 20s, so.

01:32:53:06 - 01:32:53:20
Steph
I kind of.

01:32:53:27 - 01:32:55:17
Steph
I'm kind of on the road again without a job.

01:32:55:17 - 01:32:56:03
Steph
And then.

01:32:56:03 - 01:32:57:05
Steph
Life is.

01:32:57:07 - 01:32:59:02
Steph
You know, wide open.

01:32:59:05 - 01:33:01:07
Kyle
it's awesome.

01:33:01:10 - 01:33:10:27
Kyle
Circling back a little bit to the male and female climbing partnership long term, do you feel like a male female climbing partnership can always remain platonic?

01:33:10:29 - 01:33:11:18
Kyle
Oh, yeah.

01:33:11:21 - 01:33:13:22
Kyle
Okay. Give me an example.

01:33:13:25 - 01:33:18:27
Steph
all of mine. All of them. But the one I dated. Yeah, I, I.

01:33:19:00 - 01:33:20:26
Steph
I mean, I have very, some very long.

01:33:20:26 - 01:33:25:21
Steph
Term climbing partners that are male, maybe married, maybe have kids.

01:33:25:21 - 01:33:28:14
Steph
And it's, it's always just been completely platonic.

01:33:28:17 - 01:33:29:10
Steph
And it's great.

01:33:29:10 - 01:33:30:01
Steph
It's just like.

01:33:30:05 - 01:33:31:20
Steph
There's no.

01:33:31:22 - 01:33:37:03
Steph
That whole issue of, like, relationship, and it's just not a part of it. You don't have.

01:33:37:03 - 01:33:45:04
Steph
To think about it because, you know, it's not an issue. It's it's not even a thought and neither one in your head, and you're just going to enjoy the climbing and, and talk about life. Yeah.

01:33:45:06 - 01:33:46:01
Steph
So yeah, I, I.

01:33:46:06 - 01:33:49:01
Steph
Fully believe it can be because a lot of my partnerships are like

01:33:49:01 - 01:33:49:04
Kyle
that.

01:33:49:09 - 01:34:01:20
Kyle
Have you ever had an experience where it like changed at a certain point where like romantic desire and entered entered the equation where it might not have been reciprocated.

01:34:01:22 - 01:34:03:21
Steph
had a few climbing partners that, you.

01:34:03:21 - 01:34:04:04
Steph
Know.

01:34:04:07 - 01:34:12:28
Steph
Before I was 37. And I kind of just dropped them as climbing partners, so I didn't know what to do. I was just like, oh, this is uncomfortable.

01:34:13:00 - 01:34:13:18
Steph
Or I, you.

01:34:13:18 - 01:34:17:05
Steph
Know, I just threw up really, strong signals that I wasn't interested in. And we.

01:34:17:05 - 01:34:18:06
Steph
Went on and, you know.

01:34:18:06 - 01:34:21:15
Steph
Acted like nothing ever kind of happened.

01:34:21:17 - 01:34:22:06
Steph
I was never.

01:34:22:06 - 01:34:25:00
Steph
Interested in my climbing partners previous to.

01:34:25:05 - 01:34:33:10
Steph
Yeah, being in Colorado and, Yeah.

01:34:33:12 - 01:34:38:16
Steph
Yeah. I haven't experienced that with most of my climbing partnerships. I think I threw up some pretty, pretty,

01:34:38:18 - 01:34:43:24
Steph
Big signals that I'm just here to climb and let's have some adventure and be friends and. Yeah.

01:34:43:27 - 01:34:44:12
Steph
Yeah.

01:34:44:15 - 01:35:08:29
Kyle
And what about, the relationship that you had? That was a climbing part. You said there was, like, some arguments or like, my mom told me early on when I was a kid, you know, like, you know, there's two types of females you can take. There's the one where, you know, it's you're both leading and you're both trying to limit path, and you both have your own objectives and like, then there's going to be some conflict because it's like, who's leading the ship, who's objectives are more important, whose goals are more important.

01:35:08:29 - 01:35:29:12
Kyle
And then you have, like the other partnership where it's like your goals are separate. You know, each person still has goals in life, things they're trying to do, but they're not so congruent that they bounce off of each other. Instead, it's like, you know, this person has this and I get to support her there. She supports me in this way, and there are shared interests, but they're not, competing with each other.

01:35:29:15 - 01:35:36:20
Kyle
You know, was that kind of situation that you had where you guys were kind of competing and objectives and what you were trying to be as a climber?

01:35:36:22 - 01:35:38:00
Steph
Yeah, I think I, I'm, I'm.

01:35:38:00 - 01:35:40:28
Steph
Pretty sure of myself in my life decisions.

01:35:40:28 - 01:35:46:11
Steph
And, you know, you know, where I want to go with, with my life and what I want to do, you know, even though I.

01:35:46:11 - 01:35:47:25
Steph
Just said that, the world is wide.

01:35:47:25 - 01:35:48:23
Steph
Open, I.

01:35:48:25 - 01:35:54:25
Steph
Am also, like, pretty sure myself. And I know when I want to do a climb or where I want to go, like, I, I, I make decisions and I go with.

01:35:54:25 - 01:35:56:12
Steph
Them and I don't.

01:35:56:12 - 01:35:57:10
Steph
Usually like them and.

01:35:57:10 - 01:36:00:16
Steph
Ha, and.

01:36:00:19 - 01:36:09:08
Steph
I think maybe that, you know, my partner also had his own ideas in life and they kind of just conflicted with mine a lot. And, you know, how you go about life and.

01:36:09:08 - 01:36:12:05
Steph
And, how you go about job and, and what.

01:36:12:05 - 01:36:12:27
Steph
Is a job?

01:36:12:27 - 01:36:13:14
Steph
And.

01:36:13:17 - 01:36:15:24
Steph
You know, his ideas of what was actually work.

01:36:15:24 - 01:36:16:02
Steph
And my.

01:36:16:02 - 01:36:17:11
Steph
Ideas of what was working.

01:36:17:11 - 01:36:18:08
Steph
On my.

01:36:18:11 - 01:36:22:10
Steph
My website and then the work I did on that, maybe it was it was a point of.

01:36:22:10 - 01:36:32:07
Steph
Contention at some parts that, you know, I would I would claim that I was working, you know, but it was just play, and.

01:36:32:09 - 01:36:35:02
Steph
Yeah, I think, you know, we just had different.

01:36:35:05 - 01:36:37:13
Steph
Visions of, of how life should be.

01:36:37:13 - 01:36:44:22
Steph
And how one should go about it and then ultimately just wouldn't work for a relationship and even climbing or climbing,

01:36:44:24 - 01:36:45:16
Steph
Styles.

01:36:45:16 - 01:36:56:23
Steph
And, and the way we went about a climb was a little different. And, you know, there were little conflicts that would pop up around, you know, what we climbed and, and, that kind of stuff.

01:36:56:25 - 01:37:07:05
Kyle
Do you think that you could be with a, like, climber? Okay. Like a climber is a it's such a broad statement, like climbing.

01:37:07:05 - 01:37:07:23
Kyle
It's like I could

01:37:07:25 - 01:37:08:29
Steph
be with someone who climbs.

01:37:08:29 - 01:37:09:16
Kyle
who climbs.

01:37:09:21 - 01:37:12:06
Steph
But I think,

01:37:12:08 - 01:37:18:24
Steph
I would like to separate that world for me, you know, because climbing for me is such a big piece of what I do and also what I, what I view is my.

01:37:18:24 - 01:37:20:02
Steph
Work in a way.

01:37:20:05 - 01:37:26:05
Steph
I would kind of like to, to have someone who has some other interests and maybe I can do those to like, you know, do some.

01:37:26:07 - 01:37:27:10
Steph
Mountain biking.

01:37:27:10 - 01:37:28:29
Steph
Or, you know, just something that's completely.

01:37:28:29 - 01:37:30:12
Steph
Different than climbing and go.

01:37:30:12 - 01:37:31:03
Steph
Enjoy that.

01:37:31:03 - 01:37:33:05
Steph
Together.

01:37:33:07 - 01:37:38:18
Steph
But climbing it also is always going to be there for me. And so I spend so much time on the road out.

01:37:38:22 - 01:37:41:23
Steph
Pursuing these, these rock climbs. And it would be.

01:37:41:23 - 01:37:44:07
Steph
Nice to have a little overlap there.

01:37:44:09 - 01:37:52:04
Steph
Or at least a little understanding of that. And the time commitment involved in that and that, you know, that's just a part of who I am.

01:37:52:07 - 01:37:57:20
Steph
But I know that takes a lot of my time. So that is that is like a big issue because I want to spend.

01:37:57:20 - 01:38:09:26
Steph
Time with whoever I'm with. And so, you know, finding that balance of, you know, I might have to, you know, curtail my climbing a bit, which is fine. You know, I'm getting older and things will happen. So.

01:38:09:26 - 01:38:29:10
Kyle
Yeah. Yeah. With my my relationship I've found for me personally it's a sweet spot where like, climbing is not her main passion. She likes to do it, she likes to do it with me. It's like a shared experience. And you know, she's just getting into, like, leading trad a little bit, you know, super proud of her for doing that.

01:38:29:13 - 01:38:45:07
Kyle
But it's like, definitely just like I'm the one curtailing the experience. I'm the one kind of bringing us out and like, I don't need her to to meet me there. You know? It's like, I want to show you an experience. Let me kind of provide this for you and share my skills with you. And it's just been a perfect balance.

01:38:45:07 - 01:38:54:15
Kyle
I definitely wouldn't want to be with someone who was like, all right, what are we climbing? What are we climbing? You know, like, oh, I want to do this objective, you know, like then for sure come flight.

01:38:54:17 - 01:38:56:01
Steph
yeah I agree with you entirely.

01:38:56:01 - 01:38:58:29
Steph
I think and I think that's kind of the balance I'm looking for.

01:38:59:01 - 01:38:59:23
Kyle
Nice. Yeah.

01:38:59:29 - 01:39:21:15
Kyle
Before we get back to it, if you've been listening to the show, you probably know how much time and effort and love I put into this project. The research, the conversations, the production, the editing, all of it. And while it might seem like I've got a team of people on this project, I don't. It's just me. And even with sponsors, I spend a large amount of my own personal money on this project simply because I love it.

01:39:21:17 - 01:39:46:01
Kyle
If you are a listener that's looking for a way to give back to the show in a meaningful way. Please become a Patreon subscriber. Once you become a supporting member of the Climbing Majority, not only will you feel really good about yourself, but you'll also get access to the ad free version of the show and exclusive content. If this speaks to you, click the link in the description or go to Patreon.com Slash the Climbing Majority podcast to become a supporting member of the show today.

01:39:46:03 - 01:39:51:05
Kyle
Talk to me about this book that you're putting together. So you have a guidebook and you have

01:39:51:09 - 01:39:52:23
Steph
Yeah. Currently I'm working on two

01:39:52:27 - 01:39:54:17
Kyle
two books talk to me about both of them.

01:39:54:17 - 01:39:55:15
Steph
with just one, but then.

01:39:55:15 - 01:39:58:00
Steph
The second one kind of popped into there and it's been great.

01:39:58:01 - 01:40:14:14
Steph
And yeah, that'll be a third and fourth and fifth. Hopefully that's the plan. But the one to start with and the one I've, I've thought about for years and finally feel kind of in the right position to write is my favorite climbs your favorite climb? Basically multiple rock climbs of western North America.

01:40:14:14 - 01:40:16:28
Steph
So I'm including Canada in that,

01:40:17:01 - 01:40:18:08
Steph
BC specifically.

01:40:18:08 - 01:40:26:16
Steph
Because, the bugaboo and the Squamish have some pretty awesome routes, and I've climbed there a lot and I, I think we can include them in.

01:40:26:19 - 01:40:30:10
Steph
You know, the 50 classes included Canada as well.

01:40:30:12 - 01:40:41:02
Steph
So, right now it's, it's looking like 70, but I think, you know, with, with all the good rock climbers out there, it's, it's hard to pick 50 these days, you know, we're we've just got.

01:40:41:02 - 01:40:44:14
Steph
So many and so many different climbing areas now that have been well developed.

01:40:44:14 - 01:40:48:00
Steph
And I, I've settled on 70 is a pretty good number that gives a.

01:40:48:00 - 01:40:54:01
Steph
Good, representation of, all these great climbing areas and great routes in them.

01:40:54:03 - 01:40:58:14
Steph
And so I've kind of picked my list and I've.

01:40:58:16 - 01:41:00:03
Steph
I am writing,

01:41:00:06 - 01:41:06:05
Steph
Basically an intro with maybe a little personal story, kind of like Peter Croft at his good.

01:41:06:05 - 01:41:08:20
Steph
Great and awesome. And he had these, like, these fun little.

01:41:08:20 - 01:41:12:03
Steph
Anecdotes, about his experience on the route or.

01:41:12:03 - 01:41:12:17
Steph
Someone's.

01:41:12:17 - 01:41:28:18
Steph
Experience. And I, I think those are really fun to read and gave color to the routes. I, I'm trying to add a little personal story, just, you know, maybe a sentence or two in the intro about the route. And then I'm adding a history of, of the route, because a lot of the first descent histories are rather fascinating for these routes.

01:41:28:21 - 01:41:29:12
Steph
I'm adding.

01:41:29:16 - 01:41:31:10
Steph
Just like the aspect of it.

01:41:31:10 - 01:41:36:12
Steph
The, the gear. Let's see.

01:41:36:15 - 01:41:45:10
Steph
So it's it's basically enough to get this is like a one stop shop for the route. So, you know, the gear list and then a pitch by pitch description, approach and descent.

01:41:45:18 - 01:41:52:17
Steph
And then there's a map, and then there's one of my, special overlays, you know, like the Steph bag overlay, complete.

01:41:52:17 - 01:41:55:24
Steph
With the, the pitch grade and the belay locations.

01:41:55:24 - 01:41:57:21
Steph
And the descent information all in one.

01:41:57:21 - 01:41:58:27
Steph
So kind of like the overlays I.

01:41:58:27 - 01:42:04:06
Steph
Have on my website on the. And just like, professional looking, that's, that's the intent.

01:42:04:08 - 01:42:09:06
Steph
And so kind of like a four page spread for every route, maybe a photo as well.

01:42:09:09 - 01:42:14:03
Steph
So and yeah that and I'm right.

01:42:14:03 - 01:42:18:21
Steph
Now it's you know from California, Nevada, Utah or Zona.

01:42:18:23 - 01:42:19:17
Steph
Montana.

01:42:19:17 - 01:42:26:10
Steph
Colorado, Washington BC, you know, all over the place, all these great climbing areas.

01:42:26:12 - 01:42:28:22
Steph
And I

01:42:28:24 - 01:42:34:01
Steph
So the rule is it has to be a multi pitch rock climb. So it's it's not a snow climb. You don't need to have.

01:42:34:01 - 01:42:35:16
Steph
Like heavy mountaineering experience.

01:42:35:16 - 01:42:40:29
Steph
To do these routes, because I feel like the rock climber of today is, is usually geared towards these rock.

01:42:40:29 - 01:42:41:17
Steph
Climbers.

01:42:41:17 - 01:42:52:06
Steph
And the list ranges from five four. All the way up to 512. And it's kind of a representation of, you know, my favorites over the last 20 years where I've developed as a climber.

01:42:52:06 - 01:42:53:14
Steph
From, you know,

01:42:53:16 - 01:42:59:01
Steph
The five, eight climber all the way up to being able to get myself up these five, 12 routes.

01:42:59:03 - 01:43:02:06
Steph
So it's a, it's a good range of, of those.

01:43:02:09 - 01:43:02:18
Steph
You know.

01:43:02:22 - 01:43:07:08
Steph
Achievable list by. But anyone who sets out to be a rock climber.

01:43:07:10 - 01:43:07:24
Steph
Yeah.

01:43:07:24 - 01:43:10:28
Steph
So I, I'm excited by it.

01:43:11:01 - 01:43:12:19
Steph
And.

01:43:12:21 - 01:43:33:09
Steph
Yeah. So right now I've got like seven routes that I've identified that I've always wanted to do, and they've, they like highlight routes in some of the areas that I'm including in the book. So for example, like coaches, I have a couple routes in coaches I'm considering. But Abracadabra is often listed as the best route not only in coaches but in Arizona.

01:43:33:15 - 01:43:33:20
Steph
Like.

01:43:33:20 - 01:43:34:00
Steph
Okay.

01:43:34:00 - 01:43:34:27
Steph
Well.

01:43:35:00 - 01:43:57:11
Steph
I would like if I'm including coaches, I would like to include or at least climb Abracadabra to see if I would also put it on that list. And so actually this week we're headed the goal is to to go down there and climb Abracadabra, see if it's worthy, and if so, I'm putting in the book and I've got, you know, six others in addition to that where I, I feel like so there's a couple in the needles where I've climbed in the needles.

01:43:57:11 - 01:44:01:00
Steph
It's awesome. But I feel like there's a couple that just stand out as the best.

01:44:01:00 - 01:44:03:27
Steph
And I'm not climb them, so I'm going to go down.

01:44:03:29 - 01:44:07:27
Steph
I'm not sure, like the maybe with Sean, but we don't know if it's open yet.

01:44:07:27 - 01:44:08:16
Kyle
so we'll be.

01:44:08:16 - 01:44:09:12
Kyle
There in June.

01:44:09:15 - 01:44:14:16
Steph
we're going to be there in June. I might be there in June as well if it's not open in May. June 15th

01:44:14:19 - 01:44:16:17
Kyle
Yeah, right in the middle of the month. That's where I'll be there.

01:44:16:18 - 01:44:16:25
Kyle
Yeah,

01:44:16:29 - 01:44:18:14
Steph
I'll be there. And I got two.

01:44:18:14 - 01:44:20:08
Steph
Rides to climb there,

01:44:20:11 - 01:44:23:10
Steph
To see if they're, they're worthy of the book because there's so much good stuff there.

01:44:23:12 - 01:44:23:18
Steph
Yeah.

01:44:23:18 - 01:44:24:05
Steph
Have you know

01:44:24:09 - 01:44:44:29
Kyle
I've been there once. Way is like budding tried climber. I climbed, white punks on dope on Voodoo Dome. And so I'm going back now as well. Yeah. It was, I mean, it was so long ago, I barely remember. I remember our epic getting off more than I do the climb itself. But, yeah, we're we're going back now, and obviously, I think we might just.

01:44:44:29 - 01:44:45:07
Steph
if I go.

01:44:45:07 - 01:44:47:09
Steph
With Sean next week. Which I just.

01:44:47:12 - 01:44:48:17
Steph
Don't think it's open yet because.

01:44:48:19 - 01:44:49:29
Kyle
But, we.

01:44:49:29 - 01:44:51:03
Kyle
Also just had this storm.

01:44:51:10 - 01:44:59:15
Steph
Yeah, exactly. I do plan to go there again because it's just so great. And I have a partner that really wants to go in in mid-June. I'm like, okay, I'll go there both times if I have to

01:44:59:15 - 01:45:10:07
Kyle
Cool. Yeah. Hell yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, I mean, I'll speak for, I think a lot of people, but, I can't wait for the book to come out.

01:45:10:09 - 01:45:13:00
Kyle
I think you've already written.

01:45:13:03 - 01:45:38:12
Kyle
Wow. I think, you've built such, like, a cool personal brand for yourself with, like, your tacos and everything you've done for the community. And I think that this is such a cool way to just lean into that. And so I think it's, I just in full support and I think it's such a cool, a cool move and, I can't wait to, share about it when it's ready.

01:45:38:18 - 01:45:42:18
Steph
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I hope I I've heard that from others and I hope it's I hope it's the.

01:45:42:18 - 01:45:44:17
Steph
General thought and know maybe a.

01:45:44:17 - 01:45:46:19
Steph
Way to support what I've done to just.

01:45:46:19 - 01:45:49:21
Steph
To kind of bring in that income I so desperately need right now.

01:45:49:21 - 01:45:55:12
Steph
But this is I'm just happy to put out something to the it's just kind of a compilation.

01:45:55:12 - 01:45:56:08
Steph
Of of what I've

01:45:56:14 - 01:45:59:11
Kyle
Yeah. And there's something special about like physical print.

01:45:59:17 - 01:46:01:13
Steph
Yeah. There is I've always I.

01:46:01:14 - 01:46:03:04
Steph
Have a my van right now is.

01:46:03:04 - 01:46:04:01
Steph
Three shelves full of.

01:46:04:01 - 01:46:14:11
Steph
Guidebooks. Even just in my van. I just like the print versions of things. So, yeah, there's something special about flipping through things and seeing pictures.

01:46:14:13 - 01:46:15:24
Kyle
What about the guidebook?

01:46:15:27 - 01:46:19:00
Steph
Yes, I'm writing a guidebook.

01:46:19:02 - 01:46:22:18
Steph
Should I disclose for where? I'm not sure.

01:46:22:21 - 01:46:24:11
Steph
It's for a much needed guidebook.

01:46:24:11 - 01:46:30:00
Steph
For an area that I've climbed in a lot, and, Yeah.

01:46:30:02 - 01:46:33:25
Steph
So my friend actually started his own publishing company, Todd Rawls.

01:46:33:25 - 01:46:35:06
Steph
And he,

01:46:35:08 - 01:46:37:25
Steph
Published the recent vetiver guide.

01:46:37:27 - 01:46:39:04
Steph
And.

01:46:39:07 - 01:46:50:20
Steph
Actually, I'm going to be publishing my, my 70 select through Todd because, you know, I just I like having the idea of having complete control over the formatting. I am writing it myself and formatting it myself using InDesign. And that's been a.

01:46:50:20 - 01:46:54:28
Steph
Super fun process for me. And I kind of want to give up the reins on that. And like.

01:46:55:00 - 01:47:02:17
Steph
So I did some editor who goes, oh, we need to change this in this, in this because it's it's what I like. And it's, it's kind of like I made these overlays over the years and this is the format I like.

01:47:02:17 - 01:47:03:25
Steph
And we're going to go with it.

01:47:03:25 - 01:47:06:25
Steph
So I like how I can just do that through Todd.

01:47:06:25 - 01:47:07:27
Steph
And

01:47:07:29 - 01:47:10:14
Steph
He's psyched to, to publish my book.

01:47:10:14 - 01:47:11:26
Steph
And

01:47:11:29 - 01:47:19:20
Steph
So he proposed after after I talked to him about publishing this book idea to do another guidebook that he's been thinking of and to do that together.

01:47:19:20 - 01:47:20:16
Steph
And I was.

01:47:20:16 - 01:47:22:14
Steph
Like, yeah, let's let's do that. That sounds really.

01:47:22:14 - 01:47:24:00
Steph
Fun. And when I.

01:47:24:00 - 01:47:28:04
Steph
Was in Spain, I had a lot of time because, you know, you take a lot more rest days.

01:47:28:04 - 01:47:29:21
Steph
When you, when you sport climb.

01:47:29:21 - 01:47:32:03
Steph
And I didn't have trip reports to write because.

01:47:32:03 - 01:47:33:17
Steph
You know, I don't make overlays.

01:47:33:17 - 01:47:42:26
Steph
For sport climbs. So I had a lot of time and I ended up as like, Todd, can I can I get started? And I ended up building out the entire guidebook.

01:47:42:26 - 01:47:43:23
Steph
And.

01:47:43:25 - 01:47:52:23
Steph
All the routes and everything. During the two months in Spain. And I just love the process of developing my own format. And like, this is what I really like about some guidebook.

01:47:52:23 - 01:47:54:06
Steph
So I'm going to do it. And.

01:47:54:09 - 01:47:57:12
Steph
You know, just pulling together all the things I like about guidebooks and trying to.

01:47:57:12 - 01:48:00:29
Steph
Put them in mind. And that's been so fun to to do.

01:48:00:29 - 01:48:04:01
Steph
And it's a long way off, I think still, because we've.

01:48:04:01 - 01:48:08:22
Steph
Got to get more overlay photos and, just a.

01:48:08:24 - 01:48:11:16
Steph
Just a lot of information. We still need to, to get to.

01:48:11:16 - 01:48:15:12
Steph
Have that put out. So maybe, maybe a year at

01:48:15:14 - 01:48:17:23
Kyle
Cool. For both or for the guidebook.

01:48:17:26 - 01:48:23:19
Steph
For the, the guidebook. Yeah. My book should be out. I would hope by the end of the year I'll have done these routes.

01:48:23:19 - 01:48:25:22
Steph
And have it done. And,

01:48:25:24 - 01:48:28:20
Steph
Hopefully I don't know how long the publication process will take.

01:48:28:20 - 01:48:32:26
Steph
A few months maybe, but on the shelves by early 2027.

01:48:32:29 - 01:48:36:07
Kyle
are you already reaching out to, places to get it, like, stocked

01:48:36:11 - 01:48:37:13
Steph
But that's Todd's job.

01:48:37:13 - 01:48:39:01
Kyle
and starts? Joe. Okay. All right.

01:48:39:01 - 01:48:39:12
Kyle
Todd

01:48:39:16 - 01:48:45:07
Steph
what I hired him for. That's. That's his job. If he's going to be my publisher, he's going to take the the whole publishing thing.

01:48:45:07 - 01:48:49:18
Steph
He's going to get them printed and get them distributed. You know, I'll certainly help.

01:48:49:18 - 01:48:51:21
Steph
And I think what I can do, too, is.

01:48:51:21 - 01:48:52:04
Steph
You know, my.

01:48:52:04 - 01:48:54:28
Steph
On my website provide a means for, for purchasing.

01:48:54:29 - 01:48:56:07
Steph
Them. Like.

01:48:56:07 - 01:49:01:02
Steph
Kind of like Eric Sloan does. He, he does provide a way to purchase through him. And so I can do that.

01:49:01:02 - 01:49:05:01
Steph
And then, you know, Todd would probably be the one who ships him out and Instagram.

01:49:05:01 - 01:49:09:03
Steph
I could be like, hey, my guy booked out or my books out, you know, here, here's how you buy it.

01:49:09:03 - 01:49:09:22
Steph
So

01:49:09:25 - 01:49:14:03
Kyle
Yeah. Once it comes out let me know. I'll be happy to to share it with everyone.

01:49:14:05 - 01:49:16:14
Steph
Early 2027 be my goal.

01:49:16:16 - 01:49:23:08
Kyle
cool. What. Let's see I was going to ask you what the vision of the future looks like, but I think we've already kind of

01:49:23:11 - 01:49:23:25
Steph
I have no.

01:49:23:25 - 01:49:24:05
Steph
Vision.

01:49:24:05 - 01:49:24:27
Kyle
Exactly.

01:49:25:03 - 01:49:25:14
Steph
I want to.

01:49:25:14 - 01:49:29:20
Steph
Live in my van and develop content, but it's not an indefinite.

01:49:29:22 - 01:49:36:11
Kyle
When you say content, what specifically? Like more of just the same? Or do you have some sort of vision for something else.

01:49:36:13 - 01:49:37:17
Steph
More, I mean.

01:49:37:17 - 01:49:41:29
Steph
More adventure climbs in North America, and I've got a long list of ones I still want to.

01:49:41:29 - 01:49:43:03
Steph
Do and.

01:49:43:06 - 01:49:48:01
Steph
Ones I want to do that I've already done that. I feel like I need to make a better report for.

01:49:48:07 - 01:49:48:20
Steph
You know, just.

01:49:48:20 - 01:49:53:23
Steph
Super popular climbs that I did way back when, that maybe I didn't have the best idea for.

01:49:53:25 - 01:49:54:07
Steph
Because my.

01:49:54:12 - 01:50:01:06
Steph
My beta has has improved over the years in my overlays. Yeah. I was just noticing the idea that, like, my Eagle wall or my.

01:50:01:06 - 01:50:02:14
Steph
Yeah, Elance, Eagle.

01:50:02:14 - 01:50:15:15
Steph
Lands, Topo is needs some help. And so I was like, I need to go climb Eagle Dance again because I don't even have, belay positions on that topo. So I was like, I don't know what I was thinking,

01:50:15:17 - 01:50:16:07
Kyle
Yeah, yeah.

01:50:16:10 - 01:50:18:07
Steph
So stuff like that.

01:50:18:09 - 01:50:21:24
Steph
I don't know, I, I really like what I do and I feel like that's climbers just want.

01:50:21:24 - 01:50:23:16
Steph
More of it.

01:50:23:19 - 01:50:37:22
Steph
I, you know, do have some more book ideas. Like one of my ideas for a book is to write a book about the, the top traverses in North America. So like the evolution, traverse the search, traverse the Grand traverse the pickets, traverse the.

01:50:37:24 - 01:50:38:27
Steph
The world, you know.

01:50:38:29 - 01:50:45:21
Kyle
The Goliath traverse. Yeah. Mean,

01:50:45:23 - 01:50:50:18
Kyle
Evolution. And then what's the one they linked with it? Evolution and the. I think the Palisades one.

01:50:50:21 - 01:50:51:11
Steph
Yeah, that one

01:50:51:14 - 01:50:53:27
Kyle
That one. Yeah. That one looks bar.

01:50:54:00 - 01:50:56:14
Steph
So, you know, a book of top traverses would it would be a.

01:50:56:14 - 01:51:01:06
Steph
Great next kind of Steph book.

01:51:01:08 - 01:51:01:26
Steph
So yeah, I always.

01:51:01:26 - 01:51:02:11
Steph
And.

01:51:02:13 - 01:51:04:12
Steph
Yeah, it's always stuff to do.

01:51:04:15 - 01:51:24:01
Kyle
That's awesome. Well, I, I just I wish you the best. I think, like I said, I've, I've said this before, but, what you've already done for the climbing community and the amount of information that you've just, like, willingly posted out there has just been so, so awesome.

01:51:24:01 - 01:51:45:26
Kyle
And I think. Probably a lot more people take it for granted than, than they should. And, I hope that anybody who listens to this conversation just, like, gets to know a little bit more about, like, what you've done and, and everything. And, yeah. I can't wait to see where you go and where you take everything. Yeah.

01:51:45:28 - 01:51:53:08
Kyle
Where can, people learn more about your story and kind of support what you're doing? You said, you have donations set up on your website.

01:51:53:13 - 01:51:55:19
Steph
it's pretty obvious. Across the top.

01:51:55:22 - 01:51:57:09
Kyle
A little pop up, donate, donate. Does it.

01:51:57:09 - 01:51:59:12
Steph
Well, I, I don't I don't think I have a pop up

01:51:59:18 - 01:52:00:05
Kyle
Or maybe I

01:52:00:09 - 01:52:08:18
Steph
do those annoying pop ups. I try to get rid of the pop ups, but yeah, I apologize if it's still there. I can't see it if it's there. But across the top, it says.

01:52:08:21 - 01:52:13:24
Steph
If you know, people know and it says donate and there's a Venmo and a PayPal button.

01:52:13:27 - 01:52:24:26
Kyle
Okay. Is there like pre like a pre pre-selected amounts or is it like it's just whatever type in whatever amount. Is it like a single time or a subscription based or single time.

01:52:24:28 - 01:52:26:17
Steph
I mean you can get as many times you want.

01:52:26:17 - 01:52:28:16
Steph
But yeah. Yeah.

01:52:28:18 - 01:52:30:23
Kyle
not signing up. You're not signing up for anything.

01:52:30:26 - 01:52:31:25
Steph
no fees, you know.

01:52:32:01 - 01:52:34:09
Steph
Yeah. Just just if you want to support.

01:52:34:09 - 01:52:34:24
Steph
The site.

01:52:34:24 - 01:52:37:22
Steph
Then it's donate. Yeah.

01:52:37:24 - 01:52:46:15
Steph
And, yeah, Instagram is is a place where you can go to see where I'm at. And that's that's been great because you'll see where I'm at. I, find partners that way too.

01:52:46:15 - 01:52:47:20
Steph
And,

01:52:47:22 - 01:52:52:28
Steph
It's just kind of cool to, to get messages from people in the area and just realize that there's such a community out there.

01:52:53:01 - 01:52:53:21
Steph
So.

01:52:53:24 - 01:52:54:21
Steph
Yeah.

01:52:54:23 - 01:52:55:21
Steph
Awesome. Yeah,

01:52:55:24 - 01:53:06:00
Kyle
Yeah. Thanks again for coming on. Yeah. Do you feel like we miss anything at all? No. Good. I didn't nuke Newt once. Newt. Oh. What happened to Newt?

01:53:06:03 - 01:53:06:09
Steph
Because I.

01:53:06:09 - 01:53:08:03
Steph
Remember Newt was part of the other podcast.

01:53:08:06 - 01:53:08:24
Kyle
was he?

01:53:08:27 - 01:53:09:09
Steph
Yeah.

01:53:09:09 - 01:53:09:14
Steph
I

01:53:09:14 - 01:53:11:21
Kyle
Did he did he cameo or,

01:53:11:23 - 01:53:12:21
Steph


01:53:12:24 - 01:53:13:15
Steph
I don't know.

01:53:13:15 - 01:53:29:28
Steph
Because I don't think that was video, or maybe it was, but I remember I just got Newt. He was my cat who live with me in Estes Park, and I was so happy to have a cat because I'd always wanted a cat. And, Newt's living with my my climbing partner right now. My,

01:53:30:00 - 01:53:36:03
Steph
Back with, one of my main climbing partners. He's living in Boulder with with their three cats, and,

01:53:36:05 - 01:53:42:24
Steph
He's having a nice boozy boulder life. Yeah. So he's got three little cat friends, and, yeah, he's got a good life.

01:53:42:24 - 01:53:43:27
Steph
But,

01:53:44:00 - 01:53:50:24
Steph
I miss Newt. Yeah, I, I always, I think about Newt a lot, and I get cat videos sometimes. See how he's doing.

01:53:50:26 - 01:53:55:02
Steph
But someday I'll have a cat. You know, it's always been something I've wanted, but I can't have a cat.

01:53:55:02 - 01:53:56:24
Steph
In a van. I mean, some people do,

01:53:56:26 - 01:53:57:09
Kyle
Some people.

01:53:57:09 - 01:53:57:18
Kyle
Do.

01:53:57:18 - 01:53:58:05
Kyle
I don't want

01:53:58:06 - 01:53:58:16
Steph
a cat.

01:53:58:16 - 01:54:00:18
Steph
In my van. There's a bike in my van, too.

01:54:00:18 - 01:54:01:26
Steph
And.

01:54:01:28 - 01:54:07:20
Steph
Yeah, there's just so much in my van that bike moves around and it might smash a cat. He's just so many things.

01:54:07:23 - 01:54:09:01
Steph
But,

01:54:09:03 - 01:54:11:27
Steph
Yeah. Wait until I have established life to get a cat.

01:54:11:27 - 01:54:15:21
Steph
But yeah, Newt.

01:54:15:23 - 01:54:18:15
Steph
Isaac, sir Isaac

01:54:18:18 - 01:54:20:12
Kyle
for little guy now he's having a good life.

01:54:20:15 - 01:54:24:09
Steph
had a good life in Estes Park. He ate a lot of mice.

01:54:24:11 - 01:54:26:09
Steph
He had that little wildlife for a while.

01:54:26:09 - 01:54:27:20
Steph
Now. He's is living in Boulder,

01:54:27:27 - 01:54:35:27
Kyle
Nice, nice. Awesome. Well, yeah. That's it, that's it. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Thank you.