Most of the time we come across successful climbers after their massive accomplishments…the climbs, first ascents, and daring projects that put their name on the map. But rarely do we get to meet or hear about these people before their time. Before their groundbreaking achievements that cast them into the limelight.
Today is one of those days. We get to sit down with a young crusher by the name of Joey Latina who is a local here in Las Vegas, NV. At the remarkably young age of 16 Joey is already making quick work of his path towards becoming a nationally recognized climber. With only a few years of climbing under his belt, he has already climbed routes that most of us would spend a lifetime to accomplish. The Original Route on the infamous Rainbow Wall and Buffalo Soldiers on Buffalo Wall just to name a few. These are serious, committing trad routes with some pitches tagged with the R rating. While Joey understands the severity and impressiveness of his achievements. He remains calm, humble, and focused on his goals.
We sit down and talk about how Joey found climbing and his remarkable progression from scrambling 5.5 to projecting 5.12R trad routes in under two years. We talk about his perception of risk and dive into whether or not he really understands the risk that he is undertaking on these routes. Finally, we talk about the future and start to realize that we very well might be sitting next to one of the most up and coming trad climbers of his generation.
Please rate, review the show, and share this podcast with your friends. Word of mouth is one of the most powerful tools to help us out.
Contact us:
IG: @the.climbing.majority
Email: theclimbingmajoritypodcast@gmail.com
Most of the time we come across successful climbers after their massive accomplishments…the climbs, first ascents, and daring projects that put their name on the map. But rarely do we get to meet or hear about these people before their time. Before their groundbreaking achievements that cast them into the limelight.
Today is one of those days. We get to sit down with a young crusher by the name of Joey Latina who is a local here in Las Vegas, NV. At the remarkably young age of 16 Joey is already making quick work of his path towards becoming a nationally recognized climber. With only a few years of climbing under his belt, he has already climbed routes that most of us would spend a lifetime to accomplish. The Original Route on the infamous Rainbow Wall and Buffalo Soldiers on Buffalo Wall just to name a few. These are serious, committing trad routes with some pitches tagged with the R rating. While Joey understands the severity and impressiveness of his achievements. He remains calm, humble, and focused on his goals.
We sit down and talk about how Joey found climbing and his remarkable progression from scrambling 5.5 to projecting 5.12R trad routes in under two years. We talk about his perception of risk and dive into whether or not he really understands the risk that he is undertaking on these routes. Finally, we talk about the future and start to realize that we very well might be sitting next to one of the most up and coming trad climbers of his generation.
Please rate, review the show, and share this podcast with your friends. Word of mouth is one of the most powerful tools to help us out.
Contact us:
IG: @the.climbing.majority
Email: theclimbingmajoritypodcast@gmail.com
00:00:00:10 - 00:00:15:15
Speaker 1
We are recording. Wicked awesome. Well, welcome. This is. This is a big day. We are. This is the first live recording here in Las Vegas, Nevada. And we are sitting down here with Joey. Is that Joey Latina or Joey Louis?
00:00:15:22 - 00:00:18:08
Speaker 2
You know, whichever you prefer. Okay, Well.
00:00:18:16 - 00:00:22:06
Speaker 1
Your Instagram handle is Joey Latina, so we'll just refer to you as out to give you some traction.
00:00:22:09 - 00:00:23:07
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah, yeah, That's fair.
00:00:23:08 - 00:00:41:22
Speaker 1
Okay, cool. Well, awesome, man. Welcome to the show. We're psyched to have you here. Just a little background. I met Joey via Instagram, uh, through my channel, Bronx Rocks. I think we've been following each other for the last couple of years. I've just always been inspired by his projects and what he's been sending. And, you know, he's been really chill and supportive as well through my journey.
00:00:42:09 - 00:00:59:10
Speaker 1
And lately he's been up to a lot of really cool stuff, and I've just been really interested in his story. And so that's why we're sitting down here and yeah, just super psyched to have you on the show. Um, I guess we just get started here. Just kind of introduce yourself. You know, your age, you know who you are and kind of how you found climbing.
00:00:59:22 - 00:01:19:17
Speaker 2
Okay. Yeah. So I'm a I'm Joey, and I've been. I'm 16 years old and I've now been climbing for, like, maybe three and a half years or so. And I kind of got into climbing through like rock scrambling and red rocks. So, like, you know, tagging peaks and stuff because I always thought it was cool. And yeah, that's kind of how things have been going.
00:01:19:18 - 00:01:21:14
Speaker 1
Where were your parents climbers at all?
00:01:22:06 - 00:01:23:03
Speaker 2
No, no, not at all.
00:01:23:04 - 00:01:24:07
Speaker 1
Where they hikers or.
00:01:24:08 - 00:01:40:23
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. So my parents both kind of like hiked around a bit and they always like, I don't know, I talked about like, uh, some of these peaks is kind of being cool. So at some point, I was kind of stoked to see what it was about. And then, like, at some point, hiking was kind of boring. So I was like, I'll do something cooler.
00:01:41:20 - 00:02:03:04
Speaker 1
Fair enough. Yeah. You know, we I'm interested here in your progression to kind of where you are now and we'll, we'll cover, you know, who you are as a climber in a little bit currently. But you know, you are pretty nonchalant with how you, you approach climbing, I think, in general. And so, you know, for our audience here, you know, we are the climbing majority.
00:02:03:04 - 00:02:19:15
Speaker 1
You know, we I think we represent a large group of people that are just I don't know, like, you know, we're we're pumped to be climbing five tens. We're like out for the adventure. And I think that, you know, as we'll get into your story a little bit, you're definitely a little bit on the upper echelon of in terms of performance.
00:02:20:01 - 00:02:35:03
Speaker 1
And you know, my my big curiosity here is is really how you've gotten to where you are now. And, you know, like you say, that you were scrambling and then you started climbing. Like, did you have a mentor? Did you you know, like, what was that progression like? And try to try to be as detailed as possible about it.
00:02:35:08 - 00:02:59:23
Speaker 2
Okay. So so basically, at some point, I kind of wanted to like actually pick up actual climbing. So I just went to the local climbing gym, red rock climbing center, and I kind of just started or I like never really took any classes or anything. I guess I'm I think the very first time I went there, I like took like the, like the two hour beginner class and stuff like just to, just to like, get any bases under me.
00:02:59:23 - 00:03:23:02
Speaker 2
Yeah. Then after that, I just kind of like, kind of did that on the side for a while, for a few years and then at some point, like climbing and hiking kind of merged and I was like, Oh, well, I can just climb big rafts instead of like hiking big things instead. So I like started with I think I like I got guided up maybe I think it was Dark Shadows or Birdland or one the do.
00:03:23:11 - 00:03:25:21
Speaker 1
It was a guide or a mentor.
00:03:25:21 - 00:03:29:21
Speaker 2
So this is like an AMG guide. Okay. Desert Rock Sports. Yeah. Yeah, they're great.
00:03:30:05 - 00:03:32:05
Speaker 1
Did you did you pay for that out of pocket or.
00:03:32:15 - 00:03:38:19
Speaker 2
Oh, yeah. Yeah, I did. Okay. I was like, it was fairly expensive, but yeah, it was, it was kind of also like my birthday present, so that was cool.
00:03:39:02 - 00:03:39:14
Speaker 3
Awesome man.
00:03:39:14 - 00:03:51:08
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah. So, so Dark Shadows, it was like it was cool. And then I met some other people along the way, and then I climbed some, like, killer stuff. And then at some point, I wanted to climb something a little harder. It would be a little more challenging.
00:03:51:08 - 00:03:57:04
Speaker 1
So where did you so Dark Shadows? I think you were telling us. It's like a five, eight plus or a58.
00:03:57:05 - 00:03:58:13
Speaker 2
It's like five ish and.
00:03:58:13 - 00:03:59:08
Speaker 3
Ten, ten pages.
00:03:59:11 - 00:04:00:01
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:04:00:03 - 00:04:18:00
Speaker 1
And so, you know, you want I mean, to circle back to the guide point here, I think this is something we, we, we pretty hit we hit pretty hard a lot is like promoting hiring a guide and I'd like to hear I don't think it's a very traditional path for most people. I think a lot of people are a very like have an aversion to the price point.
00:04:18:08 - 00:04:30:17
Speaker 1
They have an aversion to just hiring somebody in general. They'd rather have their friends teach them or take the risk on themselves. What really promoted you or inspired you to hire a guide? Like did someone else tell you to do it, or how did that come about?
00:04:31:04 - 00:04:50:07
Speaker 2
So really, at the time, you know, because I was like, so? So now I'm 16, of course, but I was like quite a bit younger then. I was like maybe maybe 14 and a half or something pretty soon. So yeah, yeah. It's like I didn't exactly have like a lot anybody those stoked to like, go teach, you know, like a 14 year old how to climb like a 1000 foot or out.
00:04:50:09 - 00:04:50:15
Speaker 2
Yeah.
00:04:50:15 - 00:04:50:23
Speaker 1
Yeah.
00:04:51:01 - 00:05:00:00
Speaker 2
So, so I was like, well this could be a good opportunity. Just like, get out and climb something kind of cool and, and it just like, you know, like, see, do something.
00:05:00:05 - 00:05:15:01
Speaker 1
Yeah, absolutely. Man. Yeah, I think it's, it's really cool that you've done that. And I think it's probably a big statement to kind of where you are now is just laying that foundation down. So, you know, after the five eight with a guide, you know, you, you seemed like you, you know, you caught on to it pretty quick.
00:05:15:16 - 00:05:21:01
Speaker 1
Where did you kind of go from there? Are you like jumping right into the five tens? What was the next kind of progression after that?
00:05:21:01 - 00:05:42:22
Speaker 2
Yeah, Yeah. So after that, I, uh, so I actually didn't do any, like, big rats for a while. I went back into the climbing gym and I climbed around for maybe another half year or so. And then I met, uh, I met this dude, Mason. He's super cool. They're. I'm not sure if you know him, but then him and I, like, climb this 20 foot round on Mount Wilson, which I think goes at like, 11 a B, So that was cool.
00:05:42:22 - 00:05:51:21
Speaker 2
And then we did Levitation 29, of course, after that. And then after that, I felt like fairly confident just leading. So I like climb some like easier things like eagle dance, like.
00:05:52:07 - 00:05:54:17
Speaker 3
What are the grades of these routes, if you don't mind? Yeah, the first two.
00:05:54:19 - 00:06:03:18
Speaker 2
Okay, so a woman to Mountain Dreams, it's a grade five and it's like 2200 E and it's like 511 A slash B.
00:06:03:18 - 00:06:10:01
Speaker 1
And this is So you went from a58 to a 511 B, and are you leading any of these pitches? Is it trad sport?
00:06:10:08 - 00:06:28:01
Speaker 2
It's a it's mostly trad, except the crux is mostly bolted. So actually I did lead the crux and I was pretty stoked to actually onsite it, which is cool. Wow. Yes. So there is that and then levitation. I think I only led the 11 B pitch and also on site ed and then I, I realized, you know, I could be climbing a lot harder.
00:06:28:01 - 00:06:47:08
Speaker 2
So I did some stuff on my own to like, get better at placing gear. And then I kind of started looking towards bigger things. So I guess part of that was like Climbing Eagle dance, which is like eight pitch or maybe nine pitches. TNC Nightcrawler which is like a few pitches also like Tennessee. Yeah.
00:06:47:21 - 00:07:12:17
Speaker 3
I'm really curious. So you said you had this kind of three year period where you seemed to be casually kind of like climbing around in the gym. What was kind of the grade that you so-called ascended to really quickly? How long did it take for you to get there? And then where was somewhere that you maybe started reaching a little bit of a plateau and started to have like to put serious work in to get through that if you have, you know, been there.
00:07:13:14 - 00:07:32:16
Speaker 2
So like as far as in the climbing gym actually goes, I think the like I was like doing some of the I was leading some of the rats in there. So there's like some gym five elevens and then my 512 minus is and five twelves, but it's all a gym climbing. So I didn't read Rock climbing Center at least it's like it's fairly soft but it's still it's still good training.
00:07:32:16 - 00:07:36:04
Speaker 2
You know, you get comfortable with falling in and all that good stuff.
00:07:36:20 - 00:07:57:09
Speaker 1
So I think what Max is alluding to a little bit, I think that, you know, as climbers, we are all kind of biologically gifted to reach a certain grade pretty easily just with our biomechanics and our connection to our mind. And our body and just our physicality in general. For me personally, like I reached 510 pretty quick, that was like, that's where I kind of hit my stride.
00:07:57:09 - 00:08:24:08
Speaker 1
And then five elevens were pretty easy to reach, too. But then at 512, it was like a wall. It was like compared to getting to five, ten and 11 by 12 was like very far out of reach. And it was a point where I was like, All right, I need to either like accept this is kind of where I'm at in my life as a climber or I need to, like, change my lifestyle, dedicate my life to training and finger boarding and eating better to be thinner and lighter, to be able to get this grade, you know, the way I want it to be.
00:08:24:15 - 00:08:42:04
Speaker 1
So I feel like that grade could be different for everybody. It could be, you know, five, seven for certain people, it could be five, eight. And then they have to try really hard to get to five, seven or sorry, five, nine. Do you feel like you've gotten to a place where you've like, All right, I've reached my kind of equilibrium with where my body is, and now I have to try really hard to get to a certain grade.
00:08:42:16 - 00:09:01:19
Speaker 2
So like, probably not in particular, or at least not yet, because I don't I don't know, like every time I get, like, stoked about something, I just go out there and do it until it's done. So there's that. I mean, definitely like I'd say for like a lot of roots, the grade jump between 512 and 513 is like definitely it's like a bit of a gap.
00:09:02:03 - 00:09:12:00
Speaker 2
But I think if you were like, you know, committed to like training a little bit or just like climbing the route a bit, you know, I think anybody in definitely get there if they're committed to it. Okay.
00:09:12:04 - 00:09:14:21
Speaker 1
Yeah, fair enough.
00:09:15:02 - 00:09:40:02
Speaker 3
One thing I'm really curious here is so technical proficiency in climbing can something it's something that's really tricky. It doesn't necessarily come naturally to people. And it's almost in a class of its own. Right. Beyond the physicality of sport is like having those technical proficiencies understanding gear, the strength of the gear, you know how to place it, the nuance of all that, how quickly did you pick that up?
00:09:40:02 - 00:09:46:05
Speaker 3
And if you didn't have a mentor to this day, Oh Guide, where have you kind of acquired this skill?
00:09:47:08 - 00:10:06:11
Speaker 2
So I think so. Like climbing, you know, like ten ish pitches with a guide and like removing enough pieces, I was like, Oh, okay. So that's roughly how you place a piece. And then I had like Mason, like kind of showed me a bit because he had me lead some stuff. And after that, you know, I think it just a lot of it comes with time.
00:10:06:11 - 00:10:18:04
Speaker 2
And the more you do it, obviously, the better you get at it and the more efficient you get at it. So I think you really have to put in the time for that to work out of that well. Otherwise it's just not going to ever work very well.
00:10:19:12 - 00:10:35:00
Speaker 1
Yeah, I think with one thing that was really hard for me was like when I started climbing is, you know, you get taught the basics of try. You're like, All right, this is how it works. And it's pretty easy to understand the physicality behind what's going on. And then nuts, you get it and you start to practice the different mediums and you get a pretty well understanding.
00:10:35:00 - 00:10:59:07
Speaker 1
You start to feel comfortable with what you're placing. And then, you know, with my accident, you know, I got, you know, in hindsight I got too comfortable. And so, you know, one thing I realized after the accident was like, you never really know if a piece is going to stay until you fall on it. And so, like, there's, like this weird thing where like, yeah, you, you, you placed it to the best of your knowledge, but until you actually weight it or put it through strain, you're not really 100% sure.
00:10:59:13 - 00:11:05:12
Speaker 1
Like, does that thought ever cross your mind like or are you just like every piece you put in you're just like, I know what I'm doing. This is Bomber.
00:11:05:23 - 00:11:23:02
Speaker 2
To a certain degree. Like, like definitely. But especially when it's like single page, you're getting off the ground, you know, that's like you always have to be mindful of what you're placing, you know, because obviously placing like a really bad like, like grass nut towards the bottom, it's like really this like terrible, you know, you don't want to fall on that.
00:11:23:02 - 00:11:42:12
Speaker 2
So in a sense, like, I think if I'm leading a first pitch, I never really am that stoked to fall before, like maybe getting two or three pieces in that way. I'm like not going to take a ground fall. Then obviously the higher up you get on a like a multiple, you're out, the less likely you are to like take a ground fall or ledge fall or something like that.
00:11:43:19 - 00:11:50:16
Speaker 1
I think that's pretty subjective to the grade you're climbing. I think, you know, if you're climbing like a 20 foot five, nine is probably ledges all over the place.
00:11:50:16 - 00:11:51:06
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah.
00:11:51:07 - 00:12:00:14
Speaker 1
But you know, you're on like a 511 d you know, it's probably pretty vertical or slightly overhanging. And so the fall potentially, even if you took like a 60 footer is going to be pretty all right.
00:12:01:06 - 00:12:19:20
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. I'd say like the best thing to do is yeah, just be really mindful about what you're placing, especially when you're above like ledges and stuff and just to, you know, if you're comfortable with the piece, then definitely just keep climbing. But if you're not, be a little more weary and more controlled with your movement. And yeah, kind of focus on that.
00:12:19:20 - 00:12:20:04
Speaker 2
Mm hmm.
00:12:21:19 - 00:12:42:13
Speaker 1
Okay, so you before we dive too much into the rabbit hole about all these topics, which I love, I want to kind of get the audience to a place kind of where you are now as a climber, you know? So we've gotten to the point, you know, you followed up a couple Eleven's multipage, big grade, five routes. You know, the progression here is remarkably fast, in my opinion, compared to most people that I talk to.
00:12:43:12 - 00:13:11:17
Speaker 1
And, you know, I guess my question real quick before we go into what's now is do you feel like your your quick progression was, you know, through mostly effort and time practicing the craft, or do you feel that you have a like a biological what's the word or proclivity? Yeah, like a like a proclivity to climbing. You feel like there's like a mix.
00:13:11:17 - 00:13:13:15
Speaker 1
Which one do you feel like you lean on the most?
00:13:15:11 - 00:13:33:03
Speaker 2
I'd say so. As far as actually climbing goes, I feel like I probably started in a pretty good place with like my overall strength before I started getting into climbing, because I was before I was a climber, I was like a wrestler for eight years. So I feel like I kind of already had a fair amount of grip, strength and stuff like that.
00:13:33:03 - 00:13:41:07
Speaker 2
So the progression came pretty easily, or at least like up to meet me at 512, you know, it was like pretty chill to get there as far as I'm concerned.
00:13:41:18 - 00:13:52:10
Speaker 1
Yeah. Yeah, a little bit. A little bit of both, Yeah. Kind of lifestyle training and then, I mean, for people who aren't actually watching this video, you know, you're, you're pretty lean guy. Like, if you don't mind me asking, how much do you weigh?
00:13:53:01 - 00:13:57:17
Speaker 2
I'm 100. So. So on a good day, I'm like 139.5 and.
00:13:59:06 - 00:14:00:01
Speaker 1
That's pretty specific.
00:14:00:01 - 00:14:07:18
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it ranges between that and like about 143 144. Okay. Any on like morning or evening, you know.
00:14:07:21 - 00:14:10:13
Speaker 1
Okay. So it sounds like you pay attention to this quite, quite a lot.
00:14:11:09 - 00:14:17:07
Speaker 2
Like fairly so I think I used to, I used to weigh myself more but then I was kind of like, y you know.
00:14:17:09 - 00:14:24:08
Speaker 1
So was the, the like you're focus on weigh in yourself. Was it about safety or performance?
00:14:24:23 - 00:14:41:12
Speaker 2
It was more about performance. But then I realized being 16, it doesn't really matter that much what I eat at all. And if I really wanted to, I could eat like garbage. But I try not to get into like bad habits now because, you know, when I get older, obviously it's going to be a different story for sure.
00:14:41:17 - 00:15:03:01
Speaker 3
Do you feel like you have a healthy relationship with this where you're kind of cognizant that we're in the sport, that obviously our to body weight ratio, you know, Q q squared, that law really applies as you get larger, right? So, you know, is this something that you're really cognitive of? And do you do you feel you have a healthy relationship with it, or is it something that maybe troubles you now?
00:15:03:16 - 00:15:23:00
Speaker 2
I think I have a fairly healthy relationship with it. You know, uh, so I try to maintain a kind of like where I'm at in my body weight because of like, I'm definitely not getting any high. I've been like five nine for a year now, but, uh, I think I could definitely gain more strength, so that wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.
00:15:23:04 - 00:15:30:05
Speaker 2
You know, like, I think more muscle mass would be good and being like, maybe like 150 wouldn't be a bad thing, you know?
00:15:31:12 - 00:15:50:00
Speaker 1
Yeah, I think the reason why I'm super interested in the weight is because, you know, Max and I are sitting here, we're pretty big or six to like £200 with a full rack. We're probably sitting in like 210, you know. And so, like the big thing that I realize because when I fall, I'm not sure if you know, but I broke a five kilo Newton wire like the actual eyelet of the wire snap.
00:15:50:01 - 00:16:07:03
Speaker 1
Oh, really? And so that's the reason why I decked and it was a five cool new wire like that's, you know, they say like a traditional fall can reach up to five kill and I, I clearly exceeded that and so it made me think about like, all right, I'm kind of a fucking fat ass. Like, I'm heavy, you know, I got to watch.
00:16:07:03 - 00:16:29:04
Speaker 1
Like, what I'm placing, you know, like you're talking about brass nuts. Like, I probably can't place those, you know, like, small wires, like I'm kind of salsa on now. And so, like, with your weight, weight at 140, like, that's a dramatic difference between, you know, someone like Max and I. And I think that I mean, I don't know if you've thought about this, like, have you thought about, you know, the consequences of being a heavier climber or the benefits of of your current weight and your performance?
00:16:29:04 - 00:16:32:09
Speaker 1
Like, is there a correlation there in your mind?
00:16:33:02 - 00:16:58:20
Speaker 2
I think to agree to a to a degree there is, but generally speaking, it depends on what your goals are and what you really want to do. Like, like I've seen some like some like heavier dudes, but they're like really strong, so they're like really strong boulders. But obviously then like when it comes to like enduro climbing, you know, they're like flailing, but like, uh, you know, it depends on what you're trying to do, what you're trying to achieve, where you really want to be.
00:16:58:21 - 00:17:01:08
Speaker 2
You know what your personal goals are in climbing.
00:17:01:12 - 00:17:17:12
Speaker 1
Yeah, I guess I is more and more focused on like, the protection piece and like the amount of force you're exerting on the pieces. You know, I think you could get away with, you know, falling on much smaller gear than, you know. Mat Right. So I think it's just a it's a cool a place to be in where there's a little bit more of a safety net.
00:17:17:21 - 00:17:38:02
Speaker 2
Mm hmm. Yeah, I think I think it's good choice, especially if you're concerned about on, like, that aspect of gear. Probably just to, like, always have something like relatively backed up. So, you know, if, if the not does rip out then or like like you said the eyelet breaks, then you have something else to like, you know, protect you if you fall.
00:17:38:22 - 00:17:58:16
Speaker 3
When you're climbing and kind of fluidly climbing. And obviously if you're in these higher grades, it's much, you know, as Carlos kind of alluded to, these much steeper routes where the falls are much cleaner, Do you find that if you're in kind of a flow state, you're able to place a piece and have that trust in the piece, keep climbing and climb through and just move, really?
00:17:58:17 - 00:18:10:15
Speaker 3
Or how much are you really calculating in your mind the severity of the risk and you know the consequences of what happens if this piece pulls? Is that really something that's crossing your mind a whole bunch when you're climbing?
00:18:11:08 - 00:18:28:12
Speaker 2
Usually that will cross my mind if the pieces like on like the if it's like kind of a poor piece of protection, I'm like, oh, well, if this one pulls, is the next one fine. And sometimes you just get really bad gear. So you're thinking about that. So you're obviously climbing a little more carefully and you're like trying to be less gripped, you know?
00:18:28:18 - 00:18:43:10
Speaker 2
But if like your gear is good, you know, and it's a fairly steep route, I think to a degree, you can kind of you can kind of just like push through and just keep flowing until you don't. Then if you fall in theory, you should be fine.
00:18:44:14 - 00:19:01:05
Speaker 1
You you just mentioned the word flow. And I think that, you know, for me it's like a flow state. What's your relationship with flow State slash meditation while you're climbing? Is it something that comes to you like really quick or does it take a couple of pitches to warm up? Like, are you able to get in the zone?
00:19:01:05 - 00:19:08:00
Speaker 1
Do you have a a routine at the base to help you get into the zone? Like, what's your relationship there with focus and Flow?
00:19:08:10 - 00:19:29:03
Speaker 2
I think definitely always it takes me about a pitch, uh, to to warm up a little bit. And then once, once I'm like through the first pitch, if it's gone like really smoothly, then that kind of like, sets the tone, you know? And then say, like, pitch one is like ten and then pitch twos 12, if you like, do pitch one really effortlessly and nicely and you feel good about it.
00:19:29:03 - 00:19:32:21
Speaker 2
Then going into like pitch two, you know, I think you have a higher odds of on setting.
00:19:33:11 - 00:19:33:19
Speaker 1
Yeah.
00:19:34:05 - 00:19:45:12
Speaker 3
But do you ever get, have you ever gotten yourself into a situation where you've just had a really bad day or your nerves are totally shot or anything like that? You've kind of experience and you're climbing so far?
00:19:46:07 - 00:20:05:18
Speaker 2
Yeah, definitely. Or like for example, the other day I was sport climbing and I was supposedly supposed to be warming up on this 12 day that had done in the past and it was like a, it was like in theory in my mind, I was like, okay, this should be pretty casual, you know, like an ice pump going in, you know, just totally chill out.
00:20:05:22 - 00:20:15:16
Speaker 2
I don't know what it was, but I was just getting like, so flash pumped on this little thing and it was kind of like it was irritating. But then I have to remind myself that it's not that deep and just have fun.
00:20:16:06 - 00:20:36:01
Speaker 3
Yeah, I'm kind of curious. Like you. You seem really, really casual, but like, I get, like, instinctually this sense that you kind of have, like, a bit of a killer instinct, if that makes sense. And I'm wondering what you do. Do you do anything like mentally to prepare for these routes? Like, is it something that you just naturally do?
00:20:36:02 - 00:20:47:03
Speaker 3
You show up, you go into, or is this kind of something calculated like do you meditate, Do you do self affirmations? Like how do you deal with the intensity psychologically of climbing?
00:20:47:15 - 00:20:59:06
Speaker 2
So so like in theory, you know, it's like when you see like a cool out and you get stoked on it, then you just go like walk up to the cooler and then it looks cooler, you know, in person. So you just get some.
00:20:59:06 - 00:21:00:06
Speaker 1
Stability, obviously.
00:21:01:16 - 00:21:05:15
Speaker 2
So like the more stoked on it you are like the better it's going to go. Like in theory.
00:21:05:19 - 00:21:07:12
Speaker 3
So the stoked is so high.
00:21:07:17 - 00:21:09:03
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
00:21:09:03 - 00:21:11:07
Speaker 1
That's the lesson. Keep this still kind of as possible.
00:21:11:23 - 00:21:27:02
Speaker 2
Like I say, you're looking at like a big intense wall from afar and you're like, not really sure how you're going to get there, of course, because like sometimes the approach is like quite a ways, you know, the closer you get to the wall, obviously, like the cooler it's going to look and the more stoked you're going to be to climb this cool wall.
00:21:27:06 - 00:21:43:22
Speaker 1
Yeah, I think also, at least for me, every time I look at a wall from afar, it looks way more intimidating than it does when you're actually at the base. Because at the base you get to see the holds. You. You're like, All right, Like I can I can see the first 50 feet here. And then you get up the first 50 feet, you're like, okay, I can see the next hundred feet, you know, like it's just piece by piece.
00:21:43:22 - 00:21:46:02
Speaker 1
As you go up, you just like it. It reveals itself.
00:21:46:08 - 00:21:46:22
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah.
00:21:47:12 - 00:22:04:14
Speaker 1
It's pretty cool. Okay, so circling back to kind of who you are now, So just, I guess just give us a quick round about of like what grade you're climbing now. What's your favorite kind of climbing? Just round yourself out as a climber currently sitting in this chair in Las Vegas.
00:22:05:05 - 00:22:32:12
Speaker 2
Okay. So I think overall, so I feel like a lot of people have this thing going with Spore and tried climbing. They have this mentality where, Oh, you have to be climbing 513 to climb 512 drag. But I totally think that's false. It's just totally different styles, let's say currently, like as far as tried climbing goes, I'm like aiming to do things that are like, like projects, like kind of like five, 12 plus five, 13 minus sport climbing.
00:22:32:12 - 00:22:46:05
Speaker 2
I'm like, okay, with 13 minus to mid 13. And that's like as a project, like, you know, sometimes you need to take a break from projects and do something a little easier that you can like send in a day or like half a day. You know.
00:22:46:23 - 00:22:51:13
Speaker 1
It sounds like you, you are more of a project or versus someone who's always chasing on sites.
00:22:53:00 - 00:23:15:01
Speaker 2
I think, uh, I think definitely I really like on sighting routes and especially when it comes to like long routes, I like to pick stuff that I can usually on site most of the route and maybe like have one pitch like really challenge me and maybe have something to come back for. I see one your sport climbing you is sport climbing, you know in theory was really invented to get stronger for tried climbing.
00:23:15:01 - 00:23:26:21
Speaker 2
So I think when you're sport climbing you really should be pushing yourself to like your total limit and you should be boring because you're because you can't do the move, not because you're scared or anything, you know?
00:23:27:00 - 00:23:27:20
Speaker 1
Yeah, fair enough.
00:23:29:06 - 00:23:52:03
Speaker 3
Yeah. I think the only caveat to that is if you're not like an absolute crusher and you climb like lower sport grades for fun and there's ledges and stuff, you really cognizant of that? Because I think it's easy to get wrapped up in the rhetoric of, you know, when you do see people climb really hard, there is this extra air of affordability where you have a totally vertical roof or you're climbing like, you know, you like an overhanging, you know, a cave.
00:23:52:10 - 00:24:11:07
Speaker 3
It's like you got some pretty good falls, man, you know? Yeah, it's the sport routes where like if you were maxed out, you really would not want to be falling. So there is that interesting caveat, I think when, when you know, just because our podcast is obviously catered to the majority, there's a lot of people are going to be listening that, you know, like myself don't walk up to routes and on sites.
00:24:11:07 - 00:24:30:09
Speaker 3
Well, they, you know, like I was like crux now battling a57 the other day trying to figure out how to place gear here in Red Rock. And it was a really interesting experience. And, you know, the climbing was easy, but it was just like mentally trying to figure things out and move. It's kind of funny. So but yeah, though in comparison, it's just a different animal sometimes.
00:24:31:14 - 00:24:42:16
Speaker 1
Do you have anybody that you look up to in the cult like in the community, whether local or national as like a climber that you either aspire to be or that you take a lot of advice from.
00:24:43:05 - 00:25:07:18
Speaker 2
All like, like relatively I mean, climbing, I kind of keep it more as like this thing for myself where I kind of like I like to test myself, you know, But definitely I can totally get inspired by stronger climbers and stuff or like, you know, like when, for example, an Jonathan Seegers goes up and puts like a, like a six page 14 up on, on like universal wall, I think that's pretty impressive.
00:25:07:18 - 00:25:17:15
Speaker 2
And like, stuff like that, I like look up to or like when Honnold did the Hurt recently and like, oh yeah I like basically know all those routes from scrambling. So I think doing stuff like that is pretty cool.
00:25:18:09 - 00:25:19:20
Speaker 1
Have you run into Honnold in the Canyon?
00:25:20:11 - 00:25:28:12
Speaker 2
I think I've ran into him in the canyon once and then besides that, I've like actually ran into him at like a crag a few times and also downtown ones.
00:25:28:21 - 00:25:32:18
Speaker 1
Okay, Yes. You guys know each other by name or is it you just like you saw him and then.
00:25:33:01 - 00:25:38:15
Speaker 2
No, no, not really. You know, you just kind of around. Yeah, he makes his rounds.
00:25:39:23 - 00:25:40:12
Speaker 1
That's fair.
00:25:40:20 - 00:25:48:16
Speaker 3
That's when I was actually really curious. I mean, I might as well do it here, but I was. I was talking to Kyle about this the other day. What was the heard? So this was a link up here in Red Rock.
00:25:49:00 - 00:26:12:06
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. So the hurt, I think in theory it started at, I want to say White Rock and he basically like for example, the first long rap he did or kind of long was like tunnel vision. It's like seven pitch five seven. And the idea of the hurt was just to go up and down basically every peak in the escarpment and climb as many classic routes as possible, which I think he did a pretty good job at.
00:26:12:19 - 00:26:15:06
Speaker 3
So does he walk off or does he rap the routes after.
00:26:15:22 - 00:26:34:23
Speaker 2
Some sometimes like they're walk offs? Like I think when he walked when he went down to Pine Creek, he walked off like Bridge Point or something. But a lot of them is like down climbing So Bridge mountain he down climbed the northeast a read or like, uh, I think for mescalero he down climbed can the hat and stuff like that.
00:26:35:07 - 00:26:44:10
Speaker 1
Okay are you okay so down climbing are you like are you a down climber? Are you repeller? Do you practice down climbing or is that more of a soloists practice?
00:26:44:23 - 00:27:00:07
Speaker 2
A do like a like a fair amount of down climbing, especially in the climbing gym sometimes because I feel like you can get into a better flow if you're just you're like running laps and audibly, you know, just to go up and down and up and down like maybe ten times is, is like pretty good for you. So you get more comfortable with that.
00:27:00:07 - 00:27:06:02
Speaker 2
But definitely if I have the option to rappelling get out of hand because yeah that's just sounds sounds like a lot of work. Yeah.
00:27:06:14 - 00:27:10:02
Speaker 1
Do you ever have any experience with stuck ropes here in Red Rock?
00:27:10:02 - 00:27:26:21
Speaker 2
Yeah, Yeah, for sure. There's been a few times. Usually it's just like a actually, I think there's a town on Eagle Dance where it's kind of annoying. I had to get, like, Blade down, like 70 feet just on, like, a random wall and then climb back up. And then same thing up in Mount Charleston on Universal Wall. The rope got stuck watching.
00:27:26:21 - 00:27:29:09
Speaker 2
My partner were stoked on reclaiming the pitch to get it.
00:27:32:08 - 00:28:00:04
Speaker 3
So and I think like when we were off camera, we kind of briefly talked about, well, I mean, I think you nonchalantly recommended like a ten X route to me, which, you know, I found out X means like, you know, of chance of death if you fall. So I think that's not the route for me. But I'm wondering, how did you first get into climbing routes with such risk and what was that kind of process like for you?
00:28:01:04 - 00:28:20:11
Speaker 2
So I think generally speaking, as a scrambler, I was kind of stoked about like a bit of adventure, like climbing classics, like, especially, like, you know, Crimson Chrysalis kind of to me, no fun because, like, there is not really anything fun besides the exposure. I think when you're climbing big, obscure routes, the commitments higher, the the risk is higher.
00:28:20:11 - 00:28:33:22
Speaker 2
And even if it's like a59, you know, you actually have something to focus on, which is like not pulling off blocks if it's like mega jockey. So I think it adds like an aspect of of being mindful and thinking, especially if it's like an easier graded route. You know.
00:28:34:21 - 00:28:48:22
Speaker 1
You, uh, you had said that you took a 40 foot whopper recently and that your hip was hurting afterward. How, how did you get into that situation and like, yeah, just walk us through that a little bit.
00:28:49:05 - 00:29:07:08
Speaker 2
Okay. So I think it was probably closer to I think like 30 feet, but it's still a fairly long fall. So that was on Buffalo Soldiers the like 12 C on Buffalo Wall. And I was just you know it was pitched to 12. B I was kind of stoked to go for the on site of course. So I actually I was doing pretty well I think I actually made it through the cracks.
00:29:07:08 - 00:29:27:13
Speaker 2
And there's just at a certain point where it got kind of crazy again and generally speaking, Red Rock, I'm never that stoked on placing nuts because you can always supplement for small cans and stuff. So I had left the nuts at the blade with my buddy Taylor, and I really should have brought them up because the only placement I could have place of his was a nut.
00:29:28:14 - 00:29:46:08
Speaker 2
So I kind of just, uh, kind of went for it because I was stoked about the onsite and what the holes I could see. Generally speaking, I thought were better than they actually were just kind of committed to something that I shouldn't have committed to and then like, suffer the consequences of falling because I was cracked out.
00:29:47:13 - 00:30:10:03
Speaker 3
And so this fall, like you said, I think when we we spoke, you said you, you know, took this mega where you inverted. Luckily you didn't really enjoy yourself essentially. Right. And that I mean like that sounds like a really, really terrifying experience in some ways. Right. Obviously, it's a part of climbing. If you're used to falling, obviously, someone a climber of your intensity.
00:30:10:03 - 00:30:19:10
Speaker 3
But, you know, were you really shaken after that? Like did did were there any issues that arose from that mentally kind of recouping? And and did you see that in your climbing after it?
00:30:19:20 - 00:30:36:17
Speaker 2
To a degree, yes. I was kind of I was just very disappointed that I I chose to go for that move because in my mind, I knew that it was kind of the definitely destined to be a pretty bad fall if I botched it. But I was kind of also just, you know, committed to the to the flow.
00:30:36:17 - 00:30:54:18
Speaker 2
And I knew if I fall, obviously I'm not going to die, you know, and everything should be fine. But yeah, I think for the rest of the route, I was like a little bit rattled. And then the next day I was like, Huh, Like, that's kind of weird. But obviously I start to do the rest of the route because my wife, we left her packs up on top and we wrapped it on the route.
00:30:54:18 - 00:31:11:23
Speaker 2
So it was like a lot more of just like for me, a lot of hanging and just get up. This thing of shows my hip was hurting and like, like backing her head and you know, a lot of just like, like movements on my hip were hurting. So yeah I mean, there's that.
00:31:12:04 - 00:31:13:03
Speaker 1
How's the hip doing now?
00:31:13:08 - 00:31:18:08
Speaker 2
It feels great, you know. So actually, I've been whipping on it for a few days now and it feels pretty good.
00:31:19:05 - 00:31:39:22
Speaker 1
Thanks, dude. Yeah, I was just going to ask, you know, did that fall give you perspective looking forward or was that more like a one time thing and now you're back into that state where you might, like, make that decision again, where you're like, Oh, I'm really fucking psyched on the stoked on sites, right there. Like, and you might make that decision again.
00:31:40:23 - 00:32:03:20
Speaker 2
I think I definitely could make that decision again for sure. But I think I'm also to a degree, like in my mind, I know when a fall could potentially be dangerous and when I can basically go for it. It's like, I think worst case scenario, I could have maybe broke my ilium, which that totally would have sucked, but like, it's not like I would have died or anything.
00:32:03:20 - 00:32:18:06
Speaker 2
Yeah. So I think with perspective you can, you can push yourself this as hard to say, you know, just like just be mindful is like the biggest thing. And yeah.
00:32:19:01 - 00:32:36:14
Speaker 3
So I think twice now you said you're not going to die. And I think that's that's an interesting that's an interesting one for me. So what I'm thinking of is what makes you feel so assured that you wouldn't die? And do you contemplate the risk of death in the things you were doing?
00:32:38:00 - 00:32:59:18
Speaker 2
It definitely crosses over my mind, especially on like, you know, like I mentioned earlier, that Chelsea, your roots, but you just like you generally have an idea of how far your last piece was, how good your last piece was. So generally, you know, if your piece was good, you can tend to push a little harder where if your piece was really bad, I think I would be less willing to commit to some of those moves like what I did.
00:33:00:11 - 00:33:16:05
Speaker 2
Obviously, if I knew like the pieces I place last was pretty bad and taking a fall and it might have been catastrophic, I think I probably would have backed off and then went back to the boy and like grabbed the gear I needed. But I think because I knew the last piece was so good, like a fall, it's totally going to be just fine.
00:33:16:23 - 00:33:18:18
Speaker 3
In the live stop think someone.
00:33:18:21 - 00:33:19:10
Speaker 2
Said, Oh dear.
00:33:19:23 - 00:33:22:12
Speaker 1
Oh, did it occur now? Yeah. Let's check real quick.